Did the Cyclist Protest in San Francisco Help Their Cause?

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Greg Valent on October 22, 2015 at 2:37pm

Thank you Brian, it's nice to be appreciated.

Anne, my 'hood also has stop signs every block, and, I stop for them all. Something no cyclist and few drivers around here do. Perhaps because of my age, my knees are just used to it.

Whatever you all do, keep on pedalin', safely.

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Permalink Reply by Maurice on October 22, 2015 at 6:26pm

2 related assertions I'm sick of hearing:

- "If cyclists want to be treated like cars, then they need to follow the rules for cars."

I don't want to be treated like a car.  Bicycles have their own set of rules.  Some are the same as the rules for cars.  Some are not.  Most people making this assertion cannot tell you the difference and will, for example, become furious when you pass them on the right when they're stopped in traffic or insist that you should ride on the sidewalk.  An Idaho Stop law is perfectly consistent with the bifurcated system that we already have in place.

- "If cyclists want respect, then they need to follow the law like drivers do."

Drivers ROUTINELY disregard "the law."  The speed limit is a law.  Not driving or parking in the bike lane is a law.  Not passing within 3 feet is a law.  Signaling before changing lanes or turning is a law.  Turning your headlights on when it gets dark is a law.  Coming to a complete stop at a stop sign is a law.  I see all of these violated by drivers every week.  Most of them, I see every single day.  Bikes roll stop signs routinely AND SO DO CARS.  It's simply a lot more dangerous to others when cars do it.  Remove the plank from your own eye, drivers.  In the meanwhile, respect the safety of all road users.

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Permalink Reply by Brian J Lange on October 22, 2015 at 9:05pm

I think this is a good point. An automobile is a big, heavy vehicle that can harm or kill those on smaller vehicles and on foot- it makes sense that some rules should be different for them.

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Permalink Reply by PK RPR on October 23, 2015 at 5:00am

...what a good discussion...

I will paraphrase my post from the 'rules of the road' thread

I am a scofflaw. I don't stop if I judge it to be safe and I likely never will.

I do typically yield the ROW correctly, but I have to admit that I have had a few errors in judgement on my part. One near miss when I misjudged a blind spot at a stop sign and a few cases where a dangerous driver didn't see me or refused to yield to my ROW.

To me it has nothing to do with what the laws are and everything to do with safety. I will likely never actually stop at stop signs unless there is a car already there but I have started to do better to actively Yield and slow down at every one.

When in doubt I am ready to stop and do. I think this is what curtesy is really all about. I also think that this is a much better way for us all to frame the discussion rather than 'treat us special' or 'we must all follow the letter of the law'

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Permalink Reply by Yasmeen on October 23, 2015 at 8:00am

I do think drivers get frustrated if they feel we cut line, forcing them to wait for us when it was their turn at a four-way stop. As cyclists, there are some of us that can be impatient and realize you can fly through an intersection and force the motorists to stop. This is NOT helping our cause.

I think if we could all manage to get on the same page and use a little more courtesy in these situations, it will go a long way. That is true whether or not we have an Idaho Stop law in place. I still think we need a law specifically for cyclists because it is not reasonable to expect a cyclist to stop at every stop when they are the only one at the intersection. Needing to put your foot down to do a full stop is also unreasonable to expect of cyclists when it is beyond what is necessary. I clip-in 99% of the time so it gets a bit silly to clip and unclip at every block.

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Permalink Reply by Anne Alt on October 29, 2015 at 11:44am

+1

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Permalink Reply by Irvin Steinert on October 30, 2015 at 8:53am

Exactly!

+ putting one's foot down is beyond simply stopping, it's almost parking. If one can "track stand" (feet on pedals, no forward motion) for 0.1 seconds that is a stop in my book and I can pretty much guarantee the cops are fine with that. I think many cyclists don't even slow down at empty intersections and in most cases that is safe but it isn't perceived as safe by casual onlookers.

1. Be polite
2. make it look like we're at least trying
3. smile

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Permalink Reply by Yasmeen on October 30, 2015 at 8:57am

:-) I also like to wave when drivers wave me through. 

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Permalink Reply by Yasmeen on October 27, 2015 at 2:12pm

So great to see the momentum building in a number of cities with regards to changing the laws for bikes (not requiring a full stop at a stop sign). 

http://www.outsideonline.com/2024341/new-bike-laws-might-make-it-le...

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Permalink Reply by Greg Valent on October 27, 2015 at 6:52pm

http://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20151026/west-humboldt-park/60-year-...

From article:

The 60-year-old cyclist was struck at the intersection of Kolin Avenue and LeMoyne Street at 9:50 a.m., according to Chicago Police.

LeMoyne and Kolin are both one-way streets where the crash occurred.

There are stop signs in both directions at the intersection.

Just saying...

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Permalink Reply by Filka Bean on October 29, 2015 at 9:07am

I think it's a little early to be saying anything: neither the dnainfo nor the CBS articles shared any information about the circumstances of the crash, aside from the intersection where it occurred.

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