I got pulled over this morning!

True story.

On my way in this morning, I was heading southeast bound on Elston towards the Wellington/Rockwell intersection (those who aren't familiar, it's a 6 corners type thing). Anyway, I've rode the route enough (over 2000 times) to know the timing of the light, so I can cross right when it turns green.

So, this morning as I'm coming up on the intersection, I see the cop stopped at the light (heading in the same direction). I'm also watching the timing of the lights. So I slow way down (didn't have to too much as it was quite windy and a bit cold), and as soon as I see the light to my left turn red, I add a little steam to my pedaling so I can hit the green light right before I cross the white stop line.

As soon as I cross the line, the cop pulls up next to me and starts yelling "What does a red light mean?" confused, I say it means "stop." He then yells that again, and again I say "stop". He then forces me over to the curb and gets out of his car and starts getting really confrontational about the event. At this point I'm in shock and saying that I went through a green light and he told me "we wouldn't be having this conversation if that were true."

He then goes into how ALL cyclists think they can ignore traffic laws and yet give cops shit when they do something wrong. At this point I realize this guy has a chip on his shoulder (he also told me not to call him "man" when I was talking to him Sorry for being so informal). I also say that I don't have a problem with cops at all, in fact, the majority I've met are really nice people.

He then repeatedly asks me for ID and then says this: "I hope you don't have ID." WHAT THE HELL DOES THAT MEAN!?!?! I say that I have ID and if it's ok, I need to reach into my bag to get it out. He gives me this look like I'm crazy, but quite frankly I'm not taking my chances with this dude (unfortunately the cold zaps my GOPRO battery or I'd have a nice video for you guys).

He takes my ID and gets back in his car. I sit there in the cold wondering what's about to happen. He then gets out about 2 minutes later and asks if I think I'm getting a ticket (power trip much?). I say, if I ran a red light, I would expect that. He lets me off with a warning, saying he put me in the system and if I get pulled over again, I'll most likely get a ticket.

I say thank you and ask to shake his hand and he says "no, we're good."

All this being said, I honestly thought I timed the light right. If anything I went a .5 second early, but the fact he was immediately generalizing all cyclists and cop interactions was the cue to just let him do his thing. If I did run the light, I would expect a ticket - I'm not above the law, nor do I think cyclists are.

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 4, 2014 at 3:03am
I totally agree with you and most times try not to engage. Call it instinct or an epinephrine reaction, but it's hard to think rationally in that situation — especially if you feel your life is being threatened.

Paul Michael Ignacio said:
Adam, that's sound advice from our man Doug. Learn to rise above those who are irrational, don't wildly and reflexively respond to provocation, don't attempt to argue even though you believe you were wronged, but just try to maintain your serenity and try to ride away...
Permalink Reply by Paul Michael Ignacio on March 4, 2014 at 3:36am
I understand, man. I've been there. I think we've all witnessed the instantaneous transformation from surprise to fear to rage in a driver's eyes who just didn't see you there on a bike. I know I've seethed at the unfairness of being cursed and threatened by someone who's not only insulated within a one-ton steel cage, but who instigated the whole mess to begin with! I know, man. That's why I thought it wrong that they were not-so-subtly blaming you for escalating things (I also believed I was shrewdly contrasting our man DUG's online persona to his proffered advice, but maybe I put too fine a point on it).

At the end of the day, you're a smart and capable rider, as evidenced by your riding regularly year-round. If you were reckless or unskilled you'd have been Darwined out of the equation by now. Do what you think is best. Anticipate rather than react. And speaking as someone who's slapped his fair share of rear view mirrors and punched more than one parcel van in the bike lane, always remember that the most important place you'll ever roll your bike is though your own doorway safe at home.
Permalink Reply by David P. on March 4, 2014 at 5:18am

Doug have a shot or two of malort first and then get back to us! :)

Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 5, 2014 at 5:34am

Thank you for the kind words.

Paul Michael Ignacio said:

I understand, man. I've been there. I think we've all witnessed the instantaneous transformation from surprise to fear to rage in a driver's eyes who just didn't see you there on a bike. I know I've seethed at the unfairness of being cursed and threatened by someone who's not only insulated within a one-ton steel cage, but who instigated the whole mess to begin with! I know, man. That's why I thought it wrong that they were not-so-subtly blaming you for escalating things (I also believed I was shrewdly contrasting our man DUG's online persona to his proffered advice, but maybe I put too fine a point on it).

At the end of the day, you're a smart and capable rider, as evidenced by your riding regularly year-round. If you were reckless or unskilled you'd have been Darwined out of the equation by now. Do what you think is best. Anticipate rather than react. And speaking as someone who's slapped his fair share of rear view mirrors and punched more than one parcel van in the bike lane, always remember that the most important place you'll ever roll your bike is though your own doorway safe at home.
Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 6, 2014 at 12:21pm
What it really boils down to is that I am sick and tired of being harassed and intimidated without any legal or reasonable way of fighting back. I get angry out of frustration. Every time a driver passes too close and honks, my heart races and epinephrine surges. The fact is that there is no way to fight back against these kinds of people and it's maddeningly frustrating.
Permalink Reply by Kevin C Dormant on March 6, 2014 at 12:35pm

You have a maddening unwillingness to even consider the possibility that you are doing something wrong. You may lack sufficient bike handling skills, experience, physical capabilities, and/or temperament which make you more susceptible to "harassment" as you report on an almost daily basis. Everybody's just trying to get where they're going, be they bikes, cars or pedestrians. Contrary to what some chainlinkers seem to think, there are mercifully few homicidal maniacs out there trying to off cyclists. If you have as many conflicts as you report on this forum, I am of the opinion that the problem, (and the solution) is you. 

Adam Herstein said:

What it really boils down to is that I am sick and tired of being harassed and intimidated without any legal or reasonable way of fighting back. I get angry out of frustration. Every time a driver passes too close and honks, my heart races and epinephrine surges. The fact is that there is no way to fight back against these kinds of people and it's maddeningly frustrating.
Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 6, 2014 at 1:55pm
You think that people are personally responsible for other people's actions, and are perpetuating the victim blaming that is such a problem in our society. Have you even stopped to think for even a second that maybe some people are just assholes and get off on intimidation? Or maybe they think I shouldn't even be using the road? What about my behavior leads you to believe that I bring on harassment from other people? It's not as if I am purposely provoking people, but riding in the manner I deem the most safe for my personal well-being.

It must be easy to be all high and mighty from behind your computer screen, just as it's easy for some one protected by glass and steel to harass someone on a bike.

Kevin C said:

You have a maddening unwillingness to even consider the possibility that you are doing something wrong. You may lack sufficient bike handling skills, experience, physical capabilities, and/or temperament which make you more susceptible to "harassment" as you report on an almost daily basis. Everybody's just trying to get where they're going, be they bikes, cars or pedestrians. Contrary to what some chainlinkers seem to think, there are mercifully few homicidal maniacs out there trying to off cyclists. If you have as many conflicts as you report on this forum, I am of the opinion that the problem, (and the solution) is you. 

Adam Herstein said:

What it really boils down to is that I am sick and tired of being harassed and intimidated without any legal or reasonable way of fighting back. I get angry out of frustration. Every time a driver passes too close and honks, my heart races and epinephrine surges. The fact is that there is no way to fight back against these kinds of people and it's maddeningly frustrating.
Permalink Reply by Duppie on March 6, 2014 at 3:33pm

From my daily perusing of the Chainlink you do appear to be one of the most harassed cyclists around here. Why is that?

Is that because you are more vocal than the average cyclist and telling your story to the cycling community is a way of processing these encounters?  Do you really have more altercations? Or do you have a greater than average tendency to escalate any perceived slights from drivers, which leads to more altercations?

I'm curious to hear that story.


Adam Herstein said:

You think that people are personally responsible for other people's actions, and are perpetuating the victim blaming that is such a problem in our society. Have you even stopped to think for even a second that maybe some people are just assholes and get off on intimidation? Or maybe they think I shouldn't even be using the road? What about my behavior leads you to believe that I bring on harassment from other people? It's not as if I am purposely provoking people, but riding in the manner I deem the most safe for my personal well-being.

It must be easy to be all high and mighty from behind your computer screen, just as it's easy for some one protected by glass and steel to harass someone on a bike.

Kevin C said:

You have a maddening unwillingness to even consider the possibility that you are doing something wrong. You may lack sufficient bike handling skills, experience, physical capabilities, and/or temperament which make you more susceptible to "harassment" as you report on an almost daily basis. Everybody's just trying to get where they're going, be they bikes, cars or pedestrians. Contrary to what some chainlinkers seem to think, there are mercifully few homicidal maniacs out there trying to off cyclists. If you have as many conflicts as you report on this forum, I am of the opinion that the problem, (and the solution) is you. 

Adam Herstein said:

What it really boils down to is that I am sick and tired of being harassed and intimidated without any legal or reasonable way of fighting back. I get angry out of frustration. Every time a driver passes too close and honks, my heart races and epinephrine surges. The fact is that there is no way to fight back against these kinds of people and it's maddeningly frustrating.
Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 6, 2014 at 3:51pm
Likely I am more vocal about it and these kinds of things bother me more than it bothers other people. Perhaps venting online and seeking empathy is my way of emotionally coping. Do a search though, there are plenty of similar threads/posts made by others. How many people who are not on the Chainlink feel the same way I do? How many people are scared of riding a bike in the city because of the attitudes and actions of drivers?

And before someone says "if you can't handle people honking and yelling at you, then you shouldn't be riding a bike in Chicago in the first place":
Clearly I can handle it, otherwise I wouldn't still be riding. I'm just sick being honked and yelled at, and saying "just deal with it" doesn't excuse people's behaviors. Again, it's not as if I am purposely trying to provoke people.


Duppie said:

From my daily perusing of the Chainlink you do appear to be one of the most harassed cyclists around here. Why is that?

Is that because you are more vocal than the average cyclist and telling your story to the cycling community is a way of processing these encounters?  Do you really have more altercations? Or do you have a greater than average tendency to escalate any perceived slights from drivers, which leads to more altercations?

I'm curious to hear that story.


Adam Herstein said:

You think that people are personally responsible for other people's actions, and are perpetuating the victim blaming that is such a problem in our society. Have you even stopped to think for even a second that maybe some people are just assholes and get off on intimidation? Or maybe they think I shouldn't even be using the road? What about my behavior leads you to believe that I bring on harassment from other people? It's not as if I am purposely provoking people, but riding in the manner I deem the most safe for my personal well-being.

It must be easy to be all high and mighty from behind your computer screen, just as it's easy for some one protected by glass and steel to harass someone on a bike.

Kevin C said:

You have a maddening unwillingness to even consider the possibility that you are doing something wrong. You may lack sufficient bike handling skills, experience, physical capabilities, and/or temperament which make you more susceptible to "harassment" as you report on an almost daily basis. Everybody's just trying to get where they're going, be they bikes, cars or pedestrians. Contrary to what some chainlinkers seem to think, there are mercifully few homicidal maniacs out there trying to off cyclists. If you have as many conflicts as you report on this forum, I am of the opinion that the problem, (and the solution) is you. 

Adam Herstein said:

What it really boils down to is that I am sick and tired of being harassed and intimidated without any legal or reasonable way of fighting back. I get angry out of frustration. Every time a driver passes too close and honks, my heart races and epinephrine surges. The fact is that there is no way to fight back against these kinds of people and it's maddeningly frustrating.
Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 6, 2014 at 5:37pm
Agreed, I mostly see this kind of behavior on streets with no bike lanes that I am forced to ride in the middle of the lane to avoid the door zone. I try to avoid wide streets like Western or North Ave. Often it's on a more minor street in River North, such as Oak. I don't usually get honked at on residential side streets or in heavy traffic.

So yes, road design definitely is a factor, but those streets can't always be avoided. For example, I use Oak to cut over from the Lake Front Trail to Wells because it goes all the way through and I can avoid the Rush/State triangle. I ride in the middle of the lane there for safety reasons, but to a motorist I'm just in their way. I'll move over when it's safe to do so, but I'm not putting myself in danger just so someone can speed to the next red light 5 seconds faster.

Jeff Schneider said:

I've found that the odds of having conflicts with a drivers depends strongly on the street design and traffic conditions.  I have probably never had a conflict on congested streets with slow moving cars, such as Clark in Andersonville or Broadway in Lakeview.  On those streets, it's obvious to drivers that their progress is thwarted by the throng of cars winding down the narrow street, not by little me on my bike.  However, on wide, straight, streets (e.g., Ashland or Western), where drivers expect to go fast, and swerve wildly around any obstacle (e.g., left-turners), I've been passed within inches and told to get the hell off the road.  IMO the main trigger for abusive driver behavior seems to be their perception that you are slowing them down.  They do not like to slow down.

I am fortunately able to get where I want to go on mostly bike-friendly streets.  I've had few threatening encounters with drivers.  However, I suspect that if I rode different routes, my experience might have been much more negative. 

Adam Herstein said:

Likely I am more vocal about it and these kinds of things bother me more than it bothers other people. Perhaps venting online and seeking empathy is my way of emotionally coping. Do a search though, there are plenty of similar threads/posts made by others. How many people who are not on the Chainlink feel the same way I do? How many people are scared of riding a bike in the city because of the attitudes and actions of drivers?

And before someone says "if you can't handle people honking and yelling at you, then you shouldn't be riding a bike in Chicago in the first place":
Clearly I can handle it, otherwise I wouldn't still be riding. I'm just sick being honked and yelled at, and saying "just deal with it" doesn't excuse people's behaviors. Again, it's not as if I am purposely trying to provoke people.

Permalink Reply by S on March 7, 2014 at 2:07am

On the other hand, I vaguely remember you posting about having some drivers get mad at you because you took the lane on Lincoln and ended up with cars getting stuck behind you for two miles.  You were wondering why the cars didn't just go over to another street if they were tired of being stuck behind you.  That was a while ago and maybe you're a more considerate cyclist now, but at times it seems like you don't appreciate the share part of sharing the roads.  Drivers should be considerate and respectful of cyclists but things need to work the other way around as well.

Adam Herstein said:

Likely I am more vocal about it and these kinds of things bother me more than it bothers other people. Perhaps venting online and seeking empathy is my way of emotionally coping. Do a search though, there are plenty of similar threads/posts made by others. How many people who are not on the Chainlink feel the same way I do? How many people are scared of riding a bike in the city because of the attitudes and actions of drivers?

And before someone says "if you can't handle people honking and yelling at you, then you shouldn't be riding a bike in Chicago in the first place":
Clearly I can handle it, otherwise I wouldn't still be riding. I'm just sick being honked and yelled at, and saying "just deal with it" doesn't excuse people's behaviors. Again, it's not as if I am purposely trying to provoke people.


Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on March 7, 2014 at 2:29am
That was two years ago and I don't ride in that manner anymore.

S said:

On the other hand, I vaguely remember you posting about having some drivers get mad at you because you took the lane on Lincoln and ended up with cars getting stuck behind you for two miles.  You were wondering why the cars didn't just go over to another street if they were tired of being stuck behind you.  That was a while ago and maybe you're a more considerate cyclist now, but at times it seems like you don't appreciate the share part of sharing the roads.  Drivers should be considerate and respectful of cyclists but things need to work the other way around as well.

Adam Herstein said:

Likely I am more vocal about it and these kinds of things bother me more than it bothers other people. Perhaps venting online and seeking empathy is my way of emotionally coping. Do a search though, there are plenty of similar threads/posts made by others. How many people who are not on the Chainlink feel the same way I do? How many people are scared of riding a bike in the city because of the attitudes and actions of drivers?

And before someone says "if you can't handle people honking and yelling at you, then you shouldn't be riding a bike in Chicago in the first place":
Clearly I can handle it, otherwise I wouldn't still be riding. I'm just sick being honked and yelled at, and saying "just deal with it" doesn't excuse people's behaviors. Again, it's not as if I am purposely trying to provoke people.


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