Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Rich S on November 27, 2013 at 6:05am

Police out enforcing traffic laws??? Ha!! Unfortunately just as passing on the right in parking lanes is culturally ingrained in Chicago drivers, so is not enforcing traffic laws with CPD. Outside of LSD and O'Hare they just don't do it on a regular basis. Separate topic but that's why the recent fine increases for cyclists disobeying traffic laws and drivers opening doors or passing close are pointless. Neither were enforced before or after. 

1 punishment is more effective than 100 laws. 

Carter O'Brien said:

Completely agreed.

The easy, although not free, solution is to mark intersections with proper "right turn only" markings and/or signage.  Combine that with police out enforcing these already-existing laws.  This ain't rocket science, it just takes some political backbone.

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Permalink Reply by Madopal (16.5 mi) on November 27, 2013 at 6:08am

I've also been thinking that if you put a barrier on the other side of the intersection right before the parking, it removes that area, but you still have the bus stop problem.

You are correct, though...it just takes the will.  The odd thing to me is that when you get east of the Kennedy (on the north side at least), this behavior seems FAR less prevalent.  I'm shocked at how much worse it is when all the roads are this way.  And up in Jefferson Park, Central is actually signed as a bike route.

Carter O'Brien said:

Completely agreed.

The easy, although not free, solution is to mark intersections with proper "right turn only" markings and/or signage.  Combine that with police out enforcing these already-existing laws.  This ain't rocket science, it just takes some political backbone.

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Permalink Reply by Anne Alt on November 27, 2013 at 6:36am

I like it!

Madopal (5.8 mi) said:

I feel like going in the spirit of Portage Park and putting up Burma Shave style messages in art deco fonts:

Don't be a jerk
And cause a fight
It's too dangerous
To pass on the right

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Permalink Reply by Carter O'Brien on November 27, 2013 at 6:47am

I'm mostly familiar with Diversey & Belmont for my major east-west routes, and alas, this problem is endemic east of the expressway as well.  It's particularly awful anywhere you cross the river/go under the expressway, as for a brief stretch 2 lane streets do open up as legitimate 4 lane (or more) streets.  So motorists are tempted to continue squirreling their way along the right where space allows.  Belmont just east of Western is absurd, as is Diversey east of Damen.

I think cycling conditions improve a bit as you get close to the lake simply due to the areas being so high-density that traffic runs out of room to make that squeeze.  Not for want of trying, of course.

Madopal (5.8 mi) said:

I've also been thinking that if you put a barrier on the other side of the intersection right before the parking, it removes that area, but you still have the bus stop problem.

You are correct, though...it just takes the will.  The odd thing to me is that when you get east of the Kennedy (on the north side at least), this behavior seems FAR less prevalent.  I'm shocked at how much worse it is when all the roads are this way.  And up in Jefferson Park, Central is actually signed as a bike route.

Carter O'Brien said:

Completely agreed.

The easy, although not free, solution is to mark intersections with proper "right turn only" markings and/or signage.  Combine that with police out enforcing these already-existing laws.  This ain't rocket science, it just takes some political backbone.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Madopal (16.5 mi) on November 27, 2013 at 7:11am

Hmm, must have been my north/south proclivity going from either Edgewater or South Evanston to Wicker/lakefront.  I never remember having trouble like that anywhere on Damen, Ravenswood, or California.  Heck, even Kedzie seems like no one does that.

It could also be that the closer you get to the lake, the more parking is always filled, so the wider 2 lanes can rarely become defacto 4 lanes.  I have seen the behavior you've mentioned near large intersections like Belmont/Western, but usually it's just a bottleneck like Addison going West just past California when the 4 lanes from Western become 2.

I just know people would jump in the right/left turn lanes occasionally, but I'd say I see a good 20% of drivers doing it now that I'm heading up Central to work, and it's made cycling way more challenging.

Carter O'Brien said:

I'm mostly familiar with Diversey & Belmont for my major east-west routes, and alas, this problem is endemic east of the expressway as well.  It's particularly awful anywhere you cross the river/go under the expressway, as for a brief stretch 2 lane streets do open up as legitimate 4 lane (or more) streets.  So motorists are tempted to continue squirreling their way along the right where space allows.  Belmont just east of Western is absurd, as is Diversey east of Damen.

I think cycling conditions improve a bit as you get close to the lake simply due to the areas being so high-density that traffic runs out of room to make that squeeze.  Not for want of trying, of course.

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Permalink Reply by Carter O'Brien on November 27, 2013 at 7:20am

Yeah, the north-south routes are in general much better for cyclists in my experience.  Damen going over the river on the North Side is actually a great example of where they took a de facto 4 lane street and added clearly marked bike lanes.  Bingo, problem solved.

What I know is that it is a solvable problem.  But the first step is the City acknowledging the problem exists!

Madopal (5.8 mi) said:

Hmm, must have been my north/south proclivity going from either Edgewater or South Evanston to Wicker/lakefront.  I never remember having trouble like that anywhere on Damen, Ravenswood, or California.  Heck, even Kedzie seems like no one does that.

It could also be that the closer you get to the lake, the more parking is always filled, so the wider 2 lanes can rarely become defacto 4 lanes.  I have seen the behavior you've mentioned near large intersections like Belmont/Western, but usually it's just a bottleneck like Addison going West just past California when the 4 lanes from Western become 2.

I just know people would jump in the right/left turn lanes occasionally, but I'd say I see a good 20% of drivers doing it now that I'm heading up Central to work, and it's made cycling way more challenging.

Carter O'Brien said:

I'm mostly familiar with Diversey & Belmont for my major east-west routes, and alas, this problem is endemic east of the expressway as well.  It's particularly awful anywhere you cross the river/go under the expressway, as for a brief stretch 2 lane streets do open up as legitimate 4 lane (or more) streets.  So motorists are tempted to continue squirreling their way along the right where space allows.  Belmont just east of Western is absurd, as is Diversey east of Damen.

I think cycling conditions improve a bit as you get close to the lake simply due to the areas being so high-density that traffic runs out of room to make that squeeze.  Not for want of trying, of course.

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