Red light etiquette
This has happened to me a number of times already this year on a number of different streets with bike lanes. I'm riding in a bike lane approaching a light that has just turned red. A car is turning right, which limits the space for bikes and cars going straight. I slowly approach the red light, only to be passed by cars speeding up to get to the red in front of me, leaving me very little to no room to get between the car turning right and the car going straight. Why do cars insist on doing this?? Why, when the light is red, do cars not just slow down, allow the biker to get beside the car turning right?? Speeding up to get ahead of cyclists at red lights makes no sense.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on
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Because they are in a rush.
Why would you want to be beside a car turning right at a light? I want to be directly behind of in front of them.
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Permalink Reply by Jason on
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because they dont want to wait for the cyclist to get going when the light turns green.
Whats the big deal w/ letting them go?
I hate when cyclist pile up at the front of the line at a red light. Why is is so hard for people to line up?
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Permalink Reply by PFEggs on
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'Whats the big deal w/ letting them go?'
Exactly. Why not let the biker get in front of a car at red light. The car can easily pass when the light turns green. I understand the frustration of bikes grouping at a light and I do my best to line up at a light, but in this case, there are no other bikers present. When cars speed up in front of cyclists at red lights, they cut off access to bike lane and pinch space for cyclists at red lights. More bike lanes in the city allow space for cyclists to get in front of auto traffic. Should this be standard practice to allow cyclists space to line-up in front of autos at a red light?
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Permalink Reply by Jenn_5.5 mi on
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+1
Seriously?! 2 wide is plenty... not all 10+ people on bikes needs to be in the same 10 sq ft area.
On the OP - I only 'split' cars if there is over 5' for me to fit in between and along Lincoln this typically doesn't happen. It is annoying/not safe for a driver to speed past me, then swerve over to get to the right turn lane at a red light - No one is going anywhere!?! But I would rather stand in the 'bike lane area' behind the turning cars than be squeezed.
Jason said:I hate when cyclist pile up at the front of the line at a red light. Why is is so hard for people to line up?
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Permalink Reply by Tricolor on
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I've had a taxi do this once, but in a few years of running down State in the morning and Dearborn (where you have to deal with left turning traffic) in the evening I've never had trouble with right (or left) turning traffic not waiting for move to move left and open the right lane for them. I've had a few buses with a good head of steam go around me on State, but I'm always sure to slow down so they can get back to the right with time to slow for their next stop. Just watch out for the cars, and good on you for not blocking the right turn like a lot of unaware or passive-aggressive cyclists tend to do.
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Permalink Reply by Gecko on
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To OP: I'm usually pretty courteous, but that type of behavior seriously raises my blood pressure. I usually ride around their right side, and then (if there's room) right in front of them, back to the left of the car in front of them. I also usually glare at them straight in the eyes, gesture toward the stopped traffic in front of them, and yell something along the lines of "wow, look how far all that speeding got you" and roll my eyes and shake my head. Sure, it's a little passive-aggressive, but at least it's not OVERTLY aggressive like their stupid lane change was. Also, I realize that my response can be seen as reactive and relatively emotional, but it makes me feel better.
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If it's a no turn on red, cyclists aren't doing anything wrong by sitting in front of the cars. However, I agree with you that at lights where there are NOT no turn on red signs, cyclists should wait in the right turn lane just like the rest of traffic. The 5 cars in front of you turning right will be gone by the time the light turns green, so there's no reason to split lanes and sit in front of them if you're just going to hold them up. It will just make them angry.
When I ride (and drive), I try to minimize any negative effects I might have on other traffic (i.e. don't cause people to brake or swerve around me, unless absolutely necessary due to obstacles - stopped cars, road work, etc.).
Tricolor said:I've had a taxi do this once, but in a few years of running down State in the morning and Dearborn (where you have to deal with left turning traffic) in the evening I've never had trouble with right (or left) turning traffic not waiting for move to move left and open the right lane for them. I've had a few buses with a good head of steam go around me on State, but I'm always sure to slow down so they can get back to the right with time to slow for their next stop. Just watch out for the cars, and good on you for not blocking the right turn like a lot of unaware or passive-aggressive cyclists tend to do.
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I know where you are coming from, Nick. I try to be courteous and keep my mouth shut, but I don't understand when cars zip in front and cut off cyclists at red lights. I actually had a cop car lay on the horn behind me once as I rolled up to a light that had just turned red with another car already stopped at the light waiting to turn right. Not an emergency, the cop just being an ass. Very frustrating.
Nick G said:I'm usually pretty courteous, but that type of behavior seriously raises my blood pressure. I usually ride around their right side, and then (if there's room) right in front of them, back to the left of the car in front of them. I also usually glare at them straight in the eyes, gesture toward the stopped traffic in front of them, and yell something along the lines of "wow, look how far all that speeding got you" and roll my eyes and shake my head. Sure, it's a little passive-aggressive, but at least it's not OVERTLY aggressive like their stupid lane change was. Also, I realize that my response can be seen as reactive and relatively emotional, but it makes me feel better.
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I would be very hesitant to do anything right now. The car drivers all seem to have taken "extra silly and stupid" pills this week. I have seen so much stupid. Car's at intersections with front of light left turn arrows pulling around cars that will not pull into the intersection to turn on yellow (which defeats the whole purpose of the arrows..). Cars turning right illegally on red from the middle lane in front of cars waiting in the right lane for the light before turning. Car's honking at cars that will not pull up to an intersection because the car that has not pulled up is respecting the bicycles in front of him. The stupid pills are really out in force. And I think ANYTHING which can be perceived as "aggressive or hostile" is going to get you flattened.
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Permalink Reply by David Barish on
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I read the conversation and didn't get it. I then re read the original post. A car has sped up to get to the red light first. Now there are two cars in front of the rider. One is going straight and the other turning right. Odds are they will leave the red light at a quicker pace than the bicycle. If the bike was first the cars may have to negotiate around the bike off the stop or will remain behind the bike impatiently trying to get around. Since the bike is going to stop anyway, it sound like this is the best result for all involved. Where's the issue unless the car is dangerously trying to get around?
Think of it this way- You are approaching a red light on a fixie. You are right behind a guy on a cruiser with a plush seat and a backwards hat or perhaps you come up behind grandma (God bless her) on her trike with a few groceries in her basket or perhaps mother duckling with a kid in a tagalong or perhaps the kid is getting that 16" bike on a real street. Don't you want to pass so you do not have to remain behind them when the light turns green? Sure you do but you will hopefully want to do so safely and with courtesy. The driver sees you the same way. I guess it might be nice if the driver said, "on your left" but that is usually a horn and does not get interpreted in such a friendly manner.
When there is space I will often line up in between the right turner and the straight shooter. If there is no room I am just as well behind them but to the left of the right turner.
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Good insight. When I face this situation again -- which is inevitable -- I will try to adopt your mindset and positioning.
David Barish said:I read the conversation and didn't get it. I then re read the original post. A car has sped up to get to the red light first. Now there are two cars in front of the rider. One is going straight and the other turning right. Odds are they will leave the red light at a quicker pace than the bicycle. If the bike was first the cars may have to negotiate around the bike off the stop or will remain behind the bike impatiently trying to get around. Since the bike is going to stop anyway, it sound like this is the best result for all involved. Where's the issue unless the car is dangerously trying to get around?
Think of it this way- You are approaching a red light on a fixie. You are right behind a guy on a cruiser with a plush seat and a backwards hat or perhaps you come up behind grandma (God bless her) on her trike with a few groceries in her basket or perhaps mother duckling with a kid in a tagalong or perhaps the kid is getting that 16" bike on a real street. Don't you want to pass so you do not have to remain behind them when the light turns green? Sure you do but you will hopefully want to do so safely and with courtesy. The driver sees you the same way. I guess it might be nice if the driver said, "on your left" but that is usually a horn and does not get interpreted in such a friendly manner.
When there is space I will often line up in between the right turner and the straight shooter. If there is no room I am just as well behind them but to the left of the right turner.
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Permalink Reply by yai danche on
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i don't know if i am picturing this scenario correctly. you are in a bike lane that turns into a right turn only lane? or does the bike lane simply disappear as you approach the intersection? either way, if cars are able to squeeze pass you, you are probably too far right. when i approach an intersection, i slowly drift from the middle of the bike lane to the left to limit the space they can squeeze pass me. this doesn't always work, because i have experienced mini coopers who just punch it and swerve dangerously close. either stop ahead of the first car or middlish left behind the first car. don't ever wait to the right of the first car. the motorists behind will not be able to see you!
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