Bus Rapid Transit on Ashland - should I like this?
The proposed Bus Rapid Transit strikes me as wrong, but maybe I don't understand. What I don't get is how buses can be faster if they run at surface level with all the intersections.
Also, I don't see drivers smacking their foreheads and exclaiming, "Gee, I could be riding that bus, I'm leaving the car home tomorrow!"
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Duppie on
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The CTA analysis assumes a 46% increase in modeshare from 18% to 26%. Some of that may attrition from other lines (shifting from the #50 Damen bus to the Ashland BRT), but a lot of that may be new bus riders (i.e. shifting from another modeshare to BRT)
Jeff Schneider said:As for how many drivers will switch to taking the bus, I wouldn't have a clue. But for people who already use buses or the El this could be a much nicer experience.
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Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on
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It's not really just "switching to the bus" though. BRT is not the same thing as a traditional city bus, nor is it just a glorified express bus. It's essentially a compromise between buses and light rail, offering benefits of both.
The Gadget said:I will say this, which is nothing more than anecdotal. I dont know anyone who would switch to the bus. When I'm driving on Ashland, it's either to run an errand like going to the Whole Foods, in which case I'm not taking the bus or I'm just using Ashland to go north/south but still need to go somewhere that's east/west of Ashland. But I understand why people want this, the #9 bus is TORTURE. Hell, most Chicago buses suck. But the #9 is particularly bad.
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Permalink Reply by h' Zerocats on
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I don't agree that "most Chicago buses suck" but yes, Ashland is not great.
I'm sure you realize the main reason some buses "suck" more than others is that they're stuck behind people driving to places like Whole Foods.
The Gadget said:I will say this, which is nothing more than anecdotal. I dont know anyone who would switch to the bus. When I'm driving on Ashland, it's either to run an errand like going to the Whole Foods, in which case I'm not taking the bus or I'm just using Ashland to go north/south but still need to go somewhere that's east/west of Ashland. But I understand why people want this, the #9 bus is TORTURE. Hell, most Chicago buses suck. But the #9 is particularly bad.
Duppie 13.5185km said:The CTA analysis assumes a 46% increase in modeshare from 18% to 26%. Some of that may attrition from other lines (shifting from the #50 Damen bus to the Ashland BRT), but a lot of that may be new bus riders (i.e. shifting from another modeshare to BRT)
Jeff Schneider said:As for how many drivers will switch to taking the bus, I wouldn't have a clue. But for people who already use buses or the El this could be a much nicer experience.
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People from other cities pretty consistently marvel at how good our transit system in Chicago is, and how they wish their city had something approaching it. I guess it's all a matter of perspective.
The Gadget said:It sounds cool, I hope they at least give it a try and see how it goes. But I'd bet my life that the CTA manages to screw it up somehow...it's the cynic in me.
Adam Herstein (5.5 mi) said:It's not really just "switching to the bus" though. BRT is not the same thing as a traditional city bus, nor is it just a glorified express bus. It's essentially a compromise between buses and light rail, offering benefits of both.
The Gadget said:I will say this, which is nothing more than anecdotal. I dont know anyone who would switch to the bus. When I'm driving on Ashland, it's either to run an errand like going to the Whole Foods, in which case I'm not taking the bus or I'm just using Ashland to go north/south but still need to go somewhere that's east/west of Ashland. But I understand why people want this, the #9 bus is TORTURE. Hell, most Chicago buses suck. But the #9 is particularly bad.
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Permalink Reply by Tricolor on
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On the plus side, the CTA will need to buy brand new buses for the route since the entry will be on the left. So they'll be nice and new, probably hybrids and all that. And I would expect the CPD to enforce bus lanes in ways cyclists could only dream of for the three feet of paint on the shoulder dedicated for bikes.
The Gadget said:I will say this, which is nothing more than anecdotal. I dont know anyone who would switch to the bus. When I'm driving on Ashland, it's either to run an errand like going to the Whole Foods, in which case I'm not taking the bus or I'm just using Ashland to go north/south but still need to go somewhere that's east/west of Ashland. But I understand why people want this, the #9 bus is TORTURE. Hell, most Chicago buses suck. But the #9 is particularly bad.
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Can anyone name the intersection pictured on this page?
http://www.brtchicago.com/At a glance it conjures Western and Taylor, or Ashland and Augusta.
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Maybe you should buy a bakfiets? :-)
The Gadget said:Haha, guilty. Hey man, when I make grocery runs I LOAD UP.
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That is maybe part of the problem here. People make their personal behavior the norm, and if the proposed solution does not fit their personal behavior, then the solution is not worth it. Period.
(Note: It's not just drivers. Bicyclists do this as well. I guess it is human nature)
That's why the CTA should just build the BRT line. Once it is build, people will like it and start using it. That is what the experience in other cities shows.
The Gadget said:I will say this, which is nothing more than anecdotal. I dont know anyone who would switch to the bus. When I'm driving on Ashland, it's either to run an errand like going to the Whole Foods, in which case I'm not taking the bus or I'm just using Ashland to go north/south but still need to go somewhere that's east/west of Ashland. But I understand why people want this, the #9 bus is TORTURE. Hell, most Chicago buses suck. But the #9 is particularly bad.
Duppie 13.5185km said:The CTA analysis assumes a 46% increase in modeshare from 18% to 26%. Some of that may attrition from other lines (shifting from the #50 Damen bus to the Ashland BRT), but a lot of that may be new bus riders (i.e. shifting from another modeshare to BRT)
Jeff Schneider said:As for how many drivers will switch to taking the bus, I wouldn't have a clue. But for people who already use buses or the El this could be a much nicer experience.
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Permalink Reply by JeffB on
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I like my Quik-Pak trailer when loading up: http://www.quik-pak.com/. I've had no car for 20 years in this city (although I'm only buying for myself).
I'm curious to see how the BRT works out, but it won't make any difference in how I get around, unless it makes Ashland better for biking.
The Gadget said:Those things are battleships! I dont even think it would fit in my garage. Sorry, I think for Whole Foods and Binny's runs I'll stick to the car.
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Not sure where the "non-Americans" comes in.... I think I've heard this predominantly from "non-Americans." Anyways, I have my share of frustrations about it (would need a seperate site to list them all) but I use it multiple times a week and there's a certain aroma of hating-on-transit that you get from people who never use it and are just looking for justifaction for driving everywhere, and that scent is hanging in this discussion.
Daniel G said:The thing about our transit system that they're marveling at in particular, is that we have even have one. And not a ridiculous fake gesture towards a transit 'system' like in Atlanta or wherethehellever. But non-Americans are rarely impressed with it, which is the standard we should be setting our eyes towards since we have the privilege of living in a real city in a serious state, unlike the majority of Americans. Buses need to be pleasant or fast, for anyone to want to ride one more than a mile. Right now they are neither. BRT will help one of these, at least. I think the popularity of the Lake Shore buses bodes well for brt in Chicago and I welcome the change. But I usually choose to ride when it's safe to, bus when it's not.
h' 1.0 said:
People from other cities pretty consistently marvel at how good our transit system in Chicago is, and how they wish their city had something approaching it. I guess it's all a matter of perspective.
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This one-time non-American is still amazed at the quality of public transit in Chicago after living here for 17 years.
It's dense (i.e a transit stop is never far away), it's frequent (at least the lines and times i use), and it is cheap ($2.25, no matter how far you go.)
None of these things where true when I grew up in the Netherlands.
Friends and family that visited me over the years invariably had similar thoughts.
Daniel G said:The thing about our transit system that they're marveling at in particular, is that we have even have one. And not a ridiculous fake gesture towards a transit 'system' like in Atlanta or wherethehellever. But non-Americans are rarely impressed with it, which is the standard we should be setting our eyes towards since we have the privilege of living in a real city in a serious state, unlike the majority of Americans. Buses need to be pleasant or fast, for anyone to want to ride one more than a mile. Right now they are neither. BRT will help one of these, at least. I think the popularity of the Lake Shore buses bodes well for brt in Chicago and I welcome the change. But I usually choose to ride when it's safe to, bus when it's not.
h' 1.0 said:
People from other cities pretty consistently marvel at how good our transit system in Chicago is, and how they wish their city had something approaching it. I guess it's all a matter of perspective.
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