Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by curt(is) locke on March 30, 2017 at 8:13am

Which outcome are you speaking of when you state that you "feel like society would accept it more so than the white guy getting arrested"?? I read that sentence at least five times and can’t quite unpack it.

Although they can’t dance, white folks will sure can dance around the obvious state of relations.

The CPD does not need to “train” recruits into racist practices, it’s part of the culture, both of the department and the larger society. Are you at all familiar with the Police Accountability Task Force and it’s findings last year regarding systemic racism within its ranks and its chronic use of excessive force?? But don’t worry, folks — the DOJ under President Trump and Attorney General Jeff Sessions will not provide support, guidelines, or oversight regarding police reform. It’s time for more Law & Order. Nothing to see here. Move along.

For what it’s worth, I also feel Angela was trolling us here. Although no doubt the rage she expresses is righteous and sincere, she clearly was not interested in discussion. So, why then enter the forum? To toss around a few molotov cocktails and watch what ignites? She certainly could not have hoped to "open some eyes" with her ranting.

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Permalink Reply by Yasmeen on March 30, 2017 at 8:20am

Thanks Curtis, I really appreciate what you are saying about CPD, DOJ, and the overall "state of relations".

I could not have said any of this better myself. I have started (and stopped) several responses since this thread took off. I try to maintain a certain amount of distance to allow conversations to organically grow without my interference. Again, really appreciate your response.

Permalink Reply by Carter O'Brien on March 30, 2017 at 8:28am

I agree with all of this, Curtis, and yes, the larger systemic problem is absolutely relevant here. That's why I find the probable cause thing so problematic, CPD just found a new way to apply the same old-same old.

The Sun Times has a good story today about what successful policing looks like. It's about as far from this as is imaginable:

http://chicago.suntimes.com/news/violent-crime-falls-in-2-districts...

Permalink Reply by Anne Alt on March 30, 2017 at 10:01am

The CPD does not need to “train” recruits into racist practices, it’s part of the culture, both of the department and the larger society. 

I wish this wasn't true. Sadly, it is. 

Permalink Reply by Yasmeen on March 23, 2017 at 9:43am

Really appreciating the thoughtful discussion, opinions, and insights as I've been following this thread. Disappointed is an understatement to what I'm thinking and feeling. Just as I don't like the "war on drugs", I don't like bike tickets being targeted to areas that need more bike lanes and support for cyclists. We should be encouraging more people to ride bikes, not less. And if someone is riding their bike on the sidewalk, that's an opportunity to find out why. I've used the sidewalks in a pinch on sections that I didn't feel safe on the road but got forced to ride for a few blocks e.g. Ashland, Western, Irving Park. Otherwise, I'd much rather be on the street. I believe this is why 99% of the cyclists use a sidewalk on rare occasion. And just like other cyclists, pedestrian safety is my number one priority when sharing a sidewalk.

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Permalink Reply by Jane on March 23, 2017 at 6:58pm

Another perspective -

The "poor" black areas contain far more people for whom the bicycle is their only transport. They ride to work, to the store, to the train, to the post office . . . .

The "wealthy" white neighborhoods might have bicycles, but a large number of these are strictly leisure, that are ridden down a dedicated bike path on a Sunday afternoon. For these guys, a trip to the store means getting the RV out of the garage.

When was the last time you saw a white person on a bicycle outside Walmart or Home Depot?

Or taking their kid to school?

The leisure cyclists are pretty much hidden from police view, as they are not out there on the roads, as they might even drive to the bike path with their bike on the car roof. They re not going to be seen on regular roads, coming home from work late, at night, they use their cars for utility travel.

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Permalink Reply by Carter O'Brien on March 24, 2017 at 1:55am

I was biking to school in the early/mid 80s, and as I got older and ended up working downtown I moved closer to Elston as it was such a well traveled bike route (I think it may be one of the first streets that received bike lane striping). With a kid I am now doing CTA and a Divvy (or walking), but I assure you there are an incredible number of North Siders that commute to work by bike. A good map to visualize:

http://www.chicagomag.com/city-life/June-2014/Where-Do-Chicagos-Bik...

This is not going to include people using bikes for errands, but in my experience people who bike to work tend to use their bike for other trips as well.

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Permalink Reply by Angela Ford on March 24, 2017 at 6:18pm

Wow.  Another racist perspective.  Here's a fact.  MOST Black neighborhoods aren't poor.  We're only portrayed as poor to distract you from the rich oligarchs that are looting your middle-class construct.  That poor = Black, while wealthy = White is probably the most racist comment on this thread.  

Here's another fact, Jane.  "Poor" black people don't ride bikes.  They don't ride to work, to the store, to the train, to the post office (the post office?)  We are not dark-skinned white people.  These are things white people do.  We are a vibrant culture you know nothing about.  You only know stereotypes you've been fed.

Here's another fact, Jane.  I don't keep up with my stereotypes, but you might want to actually check out the Walmart demographics.  They've got a majority white customer base.  They wouldn't even come to our neighborhoods until after they saturated all of yours.  AND, I've been Black a long time.  I have NEVER EVER seen a Black person ride a bike to a Walmart.  If you had two Black friends, they would have stopped you from saying something so ridiculous.

Here's another fact, Jane:  THE MAJORITY OF CHICAGO'S BLACK CYCLISTS ARE LEISURE CYCLISTS.  We would be "pretty much hidden from police view" too, if it weren't for our melanin.

Let me a non-supremacist perspective Jane, we get the majority of the bicycle tickets because we are Black.  Because the city is broke.  If they ticketed White people like they ticketed us, there would be hell to pay.  But they count on people like you.  You've been institutionalized to believe you are civilized and we are not.  The fact that you wrote those comments tell me a lot about you. Keep telling yourself you're awesome.  

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Permalink Reply by Waymond Smith on March 25, 2017 at 2:11am

Jane, you have no idea of what you're writing about, or your'e "trolling". These are some of the most ignorant statements that I've ever heard.

Have you ever lived in a black community, or do you only use what you hear on the "news" as your frame of reference?

Individuals like you are part of the reason for the racial divide that exists. Jane you need to keep your racist ideology to yourself!

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Permalink Reply by Jordan M S on March 25, 2017 at 8:26am

Jane's comment didn't really make sense with my personal experience, but your reaction (Waymond and Angela) seems a bit intense, no?
Using terms like "institutionalized" or "supremacist" or "racial ideology" are dialogue-killers, at least in this context.

PS Why is it that the word walmart has been linkified? I clicked on the word twice expecting to be redirected to some study concerning biking/race/corporate retail only to be sent to the bloody homepage.

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Permalink Reply by Angela Ford on March 25, 2017 at 9:29am

The fact that we are being targeted, profiled and fined while being Black is not a "dialogue" starter.  Why is anger of violations of civil rights only acceptable when happening to white people?  It is institutionalized.  It is supremacist.  I don't want to "dialogue" about it.

I'm gobsmacked by the fact that you feel perfectly fine determining in what context these terms should be introduced.  That, too, is the problem.

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Permalink Reply by Jordan M S on March 25, 2017 at 9:41am

Understood. But I wasn't calling racial targeting a dialogue starter; I was calling a message board about it a dialogue.
And I wasn't saying civil rights violations aren't institutionalized or supremacist; I was saying I think you should show care when directing those words to the previous poster.
And I wasn't trying to provide a paid link to walmart; that happened without my consent ;)

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