Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Tank-Ridin' Ryan on January 2, 2011 at 12:57pm

Umm..Gabe, you started your rant against handicapped drivers before your last post.  And now you're mentioning laws that aren't mentioned at all in the article.

 

You're confusing the hell out of me here.

Gabe said:

Ryan, read the first paragraph of my last response. As for technology - it's a scape goat. Some people shouldn't be driving PERIOD and they wanna make laws governing driving as a reason for ineptitude.

Permalink Reply by Vilda on January 2, 2011 at 1:18pm

It's simple sir. People wanna make technology to govern technology. That's silly. People are ridiculous and can't control themselves.

 

And we make laws that govern how we use technology cause people are frightened of technology.

 

I think we should just actually not allow bad drivers to drive. How about that? Retarded? Can't drive. Can't park a car? Can't drive. Can't walk more than 15 feet? Can't drive. Can't handle if you're phone goes off while you are driving or you might drive into a ditch or kill someone? Can't drive. Etc... Driving is difficult and idiots treat it as a right.

 

The rest of that shit is nonsense.

Permalink Reply by Tank-Ridin' Ryan on January 2, 2011 at 1:26pm

Ok, thanks for making your point. 

Gabe said:

It's simple sir. People wanna make technology to govern technology. That's silly. People are ridiculous and can't control themselves.

 

And we make laws that govern how we use technology cause people are frightened of technology.

 

I think we should just actually not allow bad drivers to drive. How about that? Retarded? Can't drive. Can't park a car? Can't drive. Can't walk more than 15 feet? Can't drive. Can't handle if you're phone goes off while you are driving or you might drive into a ditch or kill someone? Can't drive. Etc... Driving is difficult and idiots treat it as a right.

 

The rest of that shit is nonsense.

Permalink Reply by milesperhour on January 2, 2011 at 3:20pm

When you know better, you do better. - Maya Angelou

Because I'm assuming you don't know better, I feel the need to respond to this.  As the daughter of someone who is handicapped and uses handicapped parking spaces, it angers me that such ignorance exists in this world (even more so than able-bodied people who park in handicapped spaces, but that is a rant for another day).

My mother over came a life threatening, debilitating disease, which included learning to walk all over again.  She can walk well now, but going long distances is hard.  Handicap spaces afford her the ability to conserve her energy and use it for where she needs to go and still live an independent life.  In addition, they offer her a shorter distance of being exposed to the elements, since she can't run in the rain or snow like the rest of us.  So while you see her exit her car and assume that she is perfectly well, you couldn't be farther from the truth.  Not everyone's handicap is so easily apparent. Believe me, there is nothing more that she could hope for than to never have been struck with such a disease, requiring her to use a handicap spot. 

I truly hope something tragic never happens to you that would require you to use one for the rest of your life.  Stating that handicap people are incapable of driving is just ridiculous.  Cars can be modified for those otherwise unable to drive them.  As someone else mentioned, the larger spaces have absolutely nothing to do with one's ability to park, but for the need of more space to get in and out of the car and/or wheelchairs. By the way, she had to get a doctor's clearance to drive again.

And please don't call handicap people morons.  My mother is everything I aspire to be and overcame her illness with such positivity, strength and determination.  She, and all other handicap people, do not deserve to be the target of such a venomous statement.

Gabe said:

This shit all needs to go in the categories "things old people fear" or "things old people can't do".

 

Driving is challenging all by itself and some people shouldn't be allowed and they are. The rest of this is nonsense.

 

My fav is that handicap drivers get a HUGE ass place to park the car. Parking is the easiest aspect of driving. In reality they should have Handicap Lanes just for these morons. Ofcourse then everyone would wanna drive in them and it would defeat the purpose.

Permalink Reply by Minh on January 2, 2011 at 3:20pm

I agreed. People will continue to find ways to distract themselves no matter what they are doing. I am not sure how putting limits on technology will make idiots be more mindful and have more self-control.

Gabe said:

It's simple sir. People wanna make technology to govern technology. That's silly. People are ridiculous and can't control themselves.

 

And we make laws that govern how we use technology cause people are frightened of technology.

 

I think we should just actually not allow bad drivers to drive. How about that? Retarded? Can't drive. Can't park a car? Can't drive. Can't walk more than 15 feet? Can't drive. Can't handle if you're phone goes off while you are driving or you might drive into a ditch or kill someone? Can't drive. Etc... Driving is difficult and idiots treat it as a right.

 

The rest of that shit is nonsense.

Permalink Reply by Julie Aberman (Hochstadter) on January 2, 2011 at 3:46pm

My mom also had handicap parking access.  You couldn't tell by looking at her, but she had aliments that made it painful to walk long distances (any distance actually), or bike for that matter. 

 

On a separate note,  my dad bought my mom a bike hoping she would ride with him.  I don't think she ever used it, but I took it to college and used it for a good 10 years.  It's now one of my guest bikes.

milesperhour said:

When you know better, you do better. - Maya Angelou

Because I'm assuming you don't know better, I feel the need to respond to this.  As the daughter of someone who is handicapped and uses handicapped parking spaces, it angers me that such ignorance exists in this world (even more so than able-bodied people who park in handicapped spaces, but that is a rant for another day).

My mother over came a life threatening, debilitating disease, which included learning to walk all over again.  She can walk well now, but going long distances is hard.  Handicap spaces afford her the ability to conserve her energy and use it for where she needs to go and still live an independent life.  In addition, they offer her a shorter distance of being exposed to the elements, since she can't run in the rain or snow like the rest of us.  So while you see her exit her car and assume that she is perfectly well, you couldn't be farther from the truth.  Not everyone's handicap is so easily apparent. Believe me, there is nothing more that she could hope for than to never have been struck with such a disease, requiring her to use a handicap spot. 

I truly hope something tragic never happens to you that would require you to use one for the rest of your life.  Stating that handicap people are incapable of driving is just ridiculous.  Cars can be modified for those otherwise unable to drive them.  As someone else mentioned, the larger spaces have absolutely nothing to do with one's ability to park, but for the need of more space to get in and out of the car and/or wheelchairs. By the way, she had to get a doctor's clearance to drive again.

And please don't call handicap people morons.  My mother is everything I aspire to be and overcame her illness with such positivity, strength and determination.  She, and all other handicap people, do not deserve to be the target of such a venomous statement.

Gabe said:

This shit all needs to go in the categories "things old people fear" or "things old people can't do".

 

Driving is challenging all by itself and some people shouldn't be allowed and they are. The rest of this is nonsense.

 

My fav is that handicap drivers get a HUGE ass place to park the car. Parking is the easiest aspect of driving. In reality they should have Handicap Lanes just for these morons. Ofcourse then everyone would wanna drive in them and it would defeat the purpose.

Permalink Reply by Vilda on January 2, 2011 at 7:10pm

Oh Milesper, sentimental drivel is why people that shouldn't be driving are. Your mother might be an outstanding person but driving is extremely difficult under good circumstances and if you add physical impairments or disabilities to the equation it only gets worse. People should not just have the right to drive. And we ALL know that the licensing system is a joke. (when you are a kid your parents can take you to the "easier" DMV as an adult renewing can be done on the phone) The system is horse shit.

 

Reflexes are a HUGE part of driving. Your mom can have an otherwise normal day to a regularly functioning person but to her she can be milliseconds off (that's all the distraction time we're talking about in most cases even those for the feared technology) and someone can end up dead.

 

Give your mom a medal not a license to drive. And Maya Angelou was never one of my fav's.

milesperhour said:

When you know better, you do better. - Maya Angelou

Because I'm assuming you don't know better, I feel the need to respond to this.  As the daughter of someone who is handicapped and uses handicapped parking spaces, it angers me that such ignorance exists in this world (even more so than able-bodied people who park in handicapped spaces, but that is a rant for another day).

My mother over came a life threatening, debilitating disease, which included learning to walk all over again.  She can walk well now, but going long distances is hard.  Handicap spaces afford her the ability to conserve her energy and use it for where she needs to go and still live an independent life.  In addition, they offer her a shorter distance of being exposed to the elements, since she can't run in the rain or snow like the rest of us.  So while you see her exit her car and assume that she is perfectly well, you couldn't be farther from the truth.  Not everyone's handicap is so easily apparent. Believe me, there is nothing more that she could hope for than to never have been struck with such a disease, requiring her to use a handicap spot. 

I truly hope something tragic never happens to you that would require you to use one for the rest of your life.  Stating that handicap people are incapable of driving is just ridiculous.  Cars can be modified for those otherwise unable to drive them.  As someone else mentioned, the larger spaces have absolutely nothing to do with one's ability to park, but for the need of more space to get in and out of the car and/or wheelchairs. By the way, she had to get a doctor's clearance to drive again.

And please don't call handicap people morons.  My mother is everything I aspire to be and overcame her illness with such positivity, strength and determination.  She, and all other handicap people, do not deserve to be the target of such a venomous statement.

Gabe said:

This shit all needs to go in the categories "things old people fear" or "things old people can't do".

 

Driving is challenging all by itself and some people shouldn't be allowed and they are. The rest of this is nonsense.

 

My fav is that handicap drivers get a HUGE ass place to park the car. Parking is the easiest aspect of driving. In reality they should have Handicap Lanes just for these morons. Ofcourse then everyone would wanna drive in them and it would defeat the purpose.

Permalink Reply by milesperhour on January 2, 2011 at 9:08pm

Gabe said:

    Oh Milesper, sentimental drivel is why people that shouldn't be driving are. Your mother might be an outstanding person but driving is extremely difficult under good circumstances and if you add physical impairments or disabilities to the equation it only gets worse. People should not just have the right to drive. And we ALL know that the licensing system is a joke. (when you are a kid your parents can take you to the "easier" DMV as an adult renewing can be done on the phone) The system is horse shit.

    Reflexes are a HUGE part of driving. Your mom can have an otherwise normal day to a regularly functioning person but to her she can be milliseconds off (that's all the distraction time we're talking about in most cases even those for the feared technology) and someone can end up dead.

    Give your mom a medal not a license to drive. And Maya Angelou was never one of my fav's.


First, where did I mention anything about my mother’s reflexes being off, rendering her incapable of driving?  I said she has trouble walking distances, not that her reflexes were affected.  I will trust the expertise and judgment of her neurologist much more than your ill-conceived assumptions.

Second, I was correcting your grossly ignorant, prejudiced, and insensitive comments about handicapped people. I had hoped to shed light on this, but you are now you’re changing your argument to suit you.  You clearly did not know the reasoning for handicap spaces being larger.

“My fav is that handicap drivers get a HUGE ass place to park the car. Parking is the easiest aspect of driving. In reality they should have Handicap Lanes just for these morons.”

Besides being closer to business entrances for those who need it, handicap spaces also accommodate the extra space required to get handicapped people in and out of cars.  When my mother was wheelchair bound, I needed the extra space to get her out of the car and in a wheelchair.  Your comment that the space is large because they don’t know how to drive, made it abundantly clear that you had no clue as to the purpose of these spaces.

“So if there is someone with a wheelchair that's driving a car we are more fucked than i care to imagine.”

Again, cars can be modified.  You basically imply that someone who cannot use their legs to drive, automatically renders their hands useless.   I’m just trying to figure out your rationale on this one.  In addition, caretakers are allowed to park in handicap spots when with the handicap person, so it is not always the handicapped person driving.  See my paragraph above.

“The vast majority of the handicapped spots are used by the elderly or obese/inferm (if you won't (not can't) walk you shouldn't be driving). Not the handicapped folks that James and now Mike are gonna go grab their pitchforks for.”

You shouldn’t be so quick to judge people and believe you know everything about their ailments.  Someone looking at my mother wouldn’t know what her disability is.

“Can't walk more than 15 feet? Can't drive.”

Please explain to me how the distance one can walk is tied to their driving skills?  I once broke my (left) leg and had a handicap placard.   Walking short distances was hard for me, even more so when the hard cast was removed and I was off crutches and in a walking boot, all in the middle of a snowy Chicago winter.  However, walking was part of my daily rehab, I just couldn’t walk distances.   According to your rationale, I shouldn’t have been able to drive.  Or does this rule only apply to fat people?

Lastly, I understand your annoyance with people who are not handicapped abusing handicapped spaces and have heard what I believe is the same report on NPR.  The abuse was not on the behalf of the handicapped person though.  The problems were with their family members and caregivers using the placards while not in the presence of the handicapped person. 

Handicap parking status first has to be authorized by a doctor and then taken to the DMV.  I’m sure there is some “over-subscribing”, but as whole I think it is minimal.  If someone’s biggest ailment is their obesity, rendering them handicapped, then so be it. Be glad you can walk the extra distance.  Just don’t judge an entire population on assumptions.

Permalink Reply by Vilda on January 3, 2011 at 3:23am

See Milesper, You entered this with the wrong assumption to begin with. You thought I didn't understand the reason for a handicap spot being larger. I really don't care. Really.

 

And your rationale is AMAZING! How does ones ability to walk affect there ability to drive? Muscles. How do reflexes play into this? Your reflexes are tied to the fast twitch/slow twitch muscle fiber that for the example of your mother is going to be more easily tired than than those on a normally functioning person. Nothing magical happens when you get into a car that makes your muscles suddenly rested and better. Your muscles are now tired and operating a 2 ton vehicle. Seems like a great plan. This also addresses your being baffled at the 15 foot walking rule. I don't care if your fat or impaired. If you get tired from a miniscule amount of exertion you DON't get to drive. I don't have ill conceived anything. I'm using common sense and you are ignoring it to suit yourself.

 

And I DO NOT care that i wouldn't be able to tell whether your mom is able or not based on my assessment visually. We shouldn't lower standards on the ability to drive based on your mom's need for accommodation. We shouldn't accommodate people in this regard. A physical impairment means you can't drive. Done.

 

And yeah, yeah, i get it cause you've said it twice. A car can be modified to fit your needs. Shouldn't be done.

 

Driving is NOT a right. You want to continue to treat it as such cause your mom was sick but that doesn't make the argument correct.

Permalink Reply by Jason on January 3, 2011 at 2:27pm

This is the reason every one of these public forum fails. Because the assholes always shout the loudest drowning everyone else out. Moderators don't moderate for rudeness or common courtesy, in a vain hope that the mythical egalitarian nature of the internet will weed out the bad apples, but it just isn't so. The bad apples just take over, like bullies in a sandbox, and everyone else leaves. Because who wants to listen to this bile? The forum eventually just devolves into the lowest common denominator. It happened with Bike Forums, Chifg, and clearly chainlink is on the same arc.

Permalink Reply by Vilda on January 3, 2011 at 2:42pm

Jason have you ever come out for a ride? You sound like a hoot to hang out with. ;-)

Jason said:

This is the reason every one of these public forum fails. Because the assholes always shout the loudest drowning everyone else out. Moderators don't moderate for rudeness or common courtesy, in a vain hope that the mythical egalitarian nature of the internet will weed out the bad apples, but it just isn't so. The bad apples just take over, like bullies in a sandbox, and everyone else leaves. Because who wants to listen to this bile? The forum eventually just devolves into the lowest common denominator. It happened with Bike Forums, Chifg, and clearly chainlink is on the same arc.

Permalink Reply by Far'arned Retrogrumpalunkus #63 on January 3, 2011 at 2:44pm

Maybe he's handicapped and isn't allowed to ride by the fascists who'd rather he stay home -or even up in the attic...

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