I need people's opinions; buy a touring bike or modify my road bike for touring?

Okay, so I want to do some serious unsupported touring in the coming months and years.

I currently own a Surly Pacer road bike with high tension, low spoke count, bladed-spoke wheels. I also own a Burly nomad trailer (see attached photo).

I wondering if I should:

A. Leave the bike as-is and use the trailer to tow my gear on long trips?

B. Outfit my road bike with front/rear racks, panniers, and a beefy 36-spoke wheelset?

C. Pony up the money for a proper touring bike and install racks and panniers?


The advantage of option "A" is that I don't need to purchase anything (although a beefier wheelset would make the bike more roadworthy). The trailer is also nice because it doesn't affect the handling of the bike. Plus when I get to my destination, I can detach the trailer and enjoy a fast bike. The disadvantage is that the trailer is harder to pull in a headwind or up hills and overall the trailer has more rolling resistance than a rack/pannier setup. Plus my road bike doesn't have the gearing to pull a loaded trailer up really steep hills...and with fenders installed, the bike can't take fat tires to handle dirt and gravel roads.

The advantage of option "B" is less rolling resistance than the trailer, and less of an investment than a touring bike. The disadvantage is that I still don't have proper gearing for loaded touring in mountainous areas, or fat tires for dirt and gravel. Plus my road bike's frame is not really designed to take on racks and panniers (I'd have to install the racks using clamps)...and the bike will probably not handle well when carrying heavy loads.

Option "C" is probably the best option, but it represents a sizable investment.

It's worth note that option "B" and "C" will also require the purchase of a smaller/lighter tent and sleeping bag. The trailer has much more cargo space.

I'm probably answering my own question here for the most part, but I'm really interested in everyone's input...especially those who have done some loaded touring.

Thanks!!!


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Permalink Reply by Tony Adams on April 7, 2010 at 4:07am
Not Nathan Fillion (aka Paul) said:
I'm in the process of making the same decisions. I'll probably go with buying a new touring bike vs keeping what I have. I had a 48 hole rear wheel built a couple of months ago that I'll transfer over to a new bike when I get it. depending on how much gear you'll be hauling you may want to consider more than 36 holes. Here's a link to an article that I found helpful.... As well Sheldon Brown has a lot of useful info. I think there's a link in the article.
http://www.sentient-entity.toucansurf.com/touring_wheels.html

Blue City had some beautiful new GT Touring bikes in stock last time I checked. I think they are this Peace Tour. I seem to recall that they were asking a bit less than the MSRP of $825. They only have 32h rims though. Then again, if you are gonna swap in a 48h rear, then that should not be a problem.

Just for reference, a couple of months ago I got an '82 Schwinn Voyageur SP for $120. It is a pretty sweet riding bike. I plan on using it for some weekend touring this summer.
Permalink Reply by Brett Ratner on April 7, 2010 at 3:02pm
..
Permalink Reply by Michael A on April 7, 2010 at 3:08pm
I agree, and you can never have too many bikes

Brett Ratner said:
This is really good info...but I think by the time I swap out all these parts, I will have essentially paid for an entry-level (or used) touring bike, and ruined a really good road bike in the process.

It seems like a dedicated touring bike is certainly the way to go here.
Permalink Reply by Brett Ratner on April 7, 2010 at 3:09pm
This is really good info, but I think by the time I swap out all these parts, I will have essentially paid for an entry-level (or used) touring bike, ruined a really good road bike...and I'll wind up with a mediocre touring rig.

No matter how I approach the problem, it seems like a purpose-built touring bike is the way to go for when I'm ready to do really long adventures. But in the mean time, I think I can use my roadbike/trailer rig for weekend trips.

Kelvin Mulcky said:
I think that the shimano road derailleurs are speced to handle a max of 27 teeth on the cassette. That is a bit of a conservative estimate and they actually work with 28t, but not more. Above 28t your derailleur pulleys will rub on the cassette. You can use a LX, XT, or XTR derailleur to handle a larger cassette and they will shift perfectly with the dura-ace sti.

You could also get a smaller-ringed crank (that's what i did to solve a similiar issue before a tour on my cross bike), like 42-32-22. That way you can use a more tightly spaced cassette like 11-28 and still have good hill climbing gears. You'll spin out of 42-11 on big descents, but at 35mph you'll probably be coasting anyways...
Permalink Reply by Moc Artsy on April 7, 2010 at 3:52pm
Not sure if you've seen this:
http://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2010/04/polyvalent-mini-build-kit.html
Permalink Reply by BirdonBike on April 8, 2010 at 5:13am
I recently returned from my first extended tour and on it had to climb some pretty good hills in the Julian Alps with 75 pounds of gear on an updated Miyata 710 with a 12-27 cassette with a 46-36-26 Sugino XD600 crank. My fiancee was riding a brand new Jamis Aurora Elite, which is a great off the shelf Touring bike from Smart Bike Parts who threw in fenders, Brooks saddle, rear panniers, and offered rear rack but we already had our Tubus racks. Her drivetrain was a 12-27 with a 50-39-30. This being our first tour, we didn't really know what to expect and turned out that my drive train was pretty good for me, but we ended up having to change out the crank just before we hit at the heart of the climbs in slovenia.

I loved the feel of the bike fully-loaded with panniers (now I actually really don't like the feel of my bike without the weight) but with my Miyata, which has smaller tubes and 1" quill stem, i had a lot of trouble adjusting the balance of my load to get the ride just right. Since my return, i have bought a new Surly LHT Frame and am simply swapping my components over and putting all the old component back on the miyata for my dedicated city/strolling bike. The Surly LHT is cheap, strong, and dependable.

I would recommend nothing less than 35c tires though and you will definitely love the fact that you have fenders when the first rain comes, especially if you are touring with another person, it is just common courtesy. At some point in our tour, we were riding with a German cyclist riding a beautiful custom built expedition bike with Rolff seven speed hub and 26" wheels and Schwalbe Marathons. I was envious anytime we had to ride on loose gravel or worse, sand, because he could plow through anything with those wheels and tires. There was another point where the beautiful road through a long Albanian mountain valley turned into what look like a dried up river bed and we decided to turn back because our 37c continental travel contacts didn't have enough meat to handle 60km of that road. Now that i have the LHT which can handle wider tires, I have bought Schwalbe Marathon Extremes at 40c. I can roll through anything now, but it might be overkill for riding around the midwest.

That said, the first time you hit 35-40 mph downhill on a fully loaded touring bike is the most magical feeling ever!!!!

Brett Ratner said:
Thanks for all the good input!!!

Here's a couple of things to add about my current setup:

I have a Dura Ace 7800 triple drivetrain...so it's a 10-speed cassette in the rear (which tend to be geared more for racing than for hauling). The biggest 10-speed cassette I've found is a 12-27 tooth. Combined with the triple ring in front, that may give me adequate low gears for climbing...but true touring bikes seem to have 34t cogs in the back.

With fenders, my frame is supposed to take on 700x28c tires. Without, I think it can take 700x32c (but I would rather keep the fenders).

Axiom and Jandd make low rider racks that I can clamp onto my forks (my forks lack eyelets). I already own a rear rack that I clamp on to the rear triangle.

And yes, I have been considering a high-spoke-count wheelset for general purpose use, saving my fancy wheelset for centuries and training rides.

For now, I think I am likely to go with Salvo's advice...try a few shorter trips with the setup I have and see if it works.
Permalink Reply by BirdonBike on April 8, 2010 at 5:17am
btw....check out the blog from our tour www.birdonbike.com
Permalink Reply by Duppie on April 8, 2010 at 12:42pm
Our Co-Motion Speedster tandem has triple front (54-42-30) and a rear 12-34 IRD branded cassette. It has Dura Ace STI shifters, a Dura Ace fd and an XTR MegaRange rd (all circa 2005).
It gives us a huge range (24-122 gear inches, if I do the math right). We never have any issues shifting. The only time we had to walk was that 20+% hill in the Hilly Hundred last year.


Kelvin Mulcky said:
I think that the shimano road derailleurs are speced to handle a max of 27 teeth on the cassette. That is a bit of a conservative estimate and they actually work with 28t, but not more. Above 28t your derailleur pulleys will rub on the cassette. You can use a LX, XT, or XTR derailleur to handle a larger cassette and they will shift perfectly with the dura-ace sti.
You could also get a smaller-ringed crank (that's what i did to solve a similiar issue before a tour on my cross bike), like 42-32-22. That way you can use a more tightly spaced cassette like 11-28 and still have good hill climbing gears. You'll spin out of 42-11 on big descents, but at 35mph you'll probably be coasting anyways...
Permalink Reply by Kevin Mulcky on April 8, 2010 at 12:46pm
Ever used the 54-12?
Duppie said:
Our Co-Motion Speedster tandem has triple front (54-42-30) and a rear 12-34 IRD branded cassette. It has Dura Ace STI shifters, a Dura Ace fd and an XTR Megarange rd (all circa 2005).
It gives us a huge range (24-122 gear inches, if I do the math right). We never have any issues shifting. The only time we had to walk was that 20+% hill in the Hilly Hundred last year.

Permalink Reply by Duppie on April 8, 2010 at 1:29pm
Yes. But only on downhill with the wind in the back ;). At those times we fly!

But usually we don't need to pedal on a downhill at all. We're not a lightweight couple and our weight just makes us go faster than anyone else. We top out at around 40 mph, because I don't feel comfortable going much faster, even though we could.

A few pics from different setups:

Here is a pic from us going downhill during last years Midwest Tandem Rally in Rochester, MN going about 30 mph without pedaling.


This is a pic from our touring setup at the start of a 4-day self-supported tour through Central Michigan.


This is a pic from our credit card tour of the Route 66 bike trail last year




Kelvin Mulcky said:
Ever used the 54-12?
Duppie said:
Our Co-Motion Speedster tandem has triple front (54-42-30) and a rear 12-34 IRD branded cassette. It has Dura Ace STI shifters, a Dura Ace fd and an XTR Megarange rd (all circa 2005).
It gives us a huge range (24-122 gear inches, if I do the math right). We never have any issues shifting. The only time we had to walk was that 20+% hill in the Hilly Hundred last year.

Permalink Reply by dan brown on April 9, 2010 at 3:30am
great photos Duppie.

I've been (on the caboose) of a tandem paceline (with just me and my road bike) and there is nothting
sweeter than seeing the cyclometer hit 30+ mph while you are only pedaling to keep balance and the
HRM is dropping and dropping...

Duppie said:
Yes. But only on downhill with the wind in the back ;). At those times we fly!

But usually we don't need to pedal on a downhill at all. We're not a lightweight couple and our weight just makes us go faster than anyone else. We top out at around 40 mph, because I don't feel comfortable going much faster, even though we could.

A few pics from different setups:

Here is a pic from us going downhill during last years Midwest Tandem Rally in Rochester, MN going about 30 mph without pedaling.


This is a pic from our touring setup at the start of a 4-day self-supported tour through Central Michigan.


This is a pic from our credit card tour of the Route 66 bike trail last year




Kelvin Mulcky said:
Ever used the 54-12?
Duppie said:
Our Co-Motion Speedster tandem has triple front (54-42-30) and a rear 12-34 IRD branded cassette. It has Dura Ace STI shifters, a Dura Ace fd and an XTR Megarange rd (all circa 2005).
It gives us a huge range (24-122 gear inches, if I do the math right). We never have any issues shifting. The only time we had to walk was that 20+% hill in the Hilly Hundred last year.

Permalink Reply by Brett Ratner on April 9, 2010 at 1:41pm
I know the hill of which you speak. Tabor was its name.

Duppie said:
Our Co-Motion Speedster tandem has triple front (54-42-30) and a rear 12-34 IRD branded cassette. It has Dura Ace STI shifters, a Dura Ace fd and an XTR MegaRange rd (all circa 2005).
It gives us a huge range (24-122 gear inches, if I do the math right). We never have any issues shifting. The only time we had to walk was that 20+% hill in the Hilly Hundred last year.


Kelvin Mulcky said:
I think that the shimano road derailleurs are speced to handle a max of 27 teeth on the cassette. That is a bit of a conservative estimate and they actually work with 28t, but not more. Above 28t your derailleur pulleys will rub on the cassette. You can use a LX, XT, or XTR derailleur to handle a larger cassette and they will shift perfectly with the dura-ace sti.
You could also get a smaller-ringed crank (that's what i did to solve a similiar issue before a tour on my cross bike), like 42-32-22. That way you can use a more tightly spaced cassette like 11-28 and still have good hill climbing gears. You'll spin out of 42-11 on big descents, but at 35mph you'll probably be coasting anyways...

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