Milwaukee PBL discussion thread
I've been looking for a dedicated thread to discuss the new PBLs on Milwaukee but haven't seen one surface.
What do you guys think???
I'm loving them. It's too bad they aren't truly protected for the entire stretch between Kinzie and Elston, but they are pretty great. It feels so much safer and saner to me, all around.
Three specific thoughts:
(1) I think there is, generally, enough room for faster bikers on the left and slower bikers on the right, which had been my primary concern. Anyone have good/bad experiences with this so far?
(2) The new situation where NB Milwaukee meets Elston. Love or hate? NB cyclists definitely have more of a wait here than they used to. A bit of a bummer but maybe a net positive when you factor in increased safety? I'm not sure.
(3) The best thing CDOT did as part of this project isn't even on Milwaukee: it's on Kinzie, at the Milwaukee intersection. In the past, cars waiting to turn north on Milwaukee off of Kinzie were supposed to queue up in the single WB traffic lane, but, too often, a car would cross the bike lane and wait to turn right in the no parking area next to Blommer's, adjacent to any cyclists waiting at the red light. Illegal, but what are you going to do about it. Now, CDOT has put up bollards to prevent any car from entering the intersection from the no parking zone. So awesome. Last night a car pulled across the bike lane early into the no parking zone, in the hope of getting to the head of the line. Sorry, bud! Was hilarious watching him sit there in the no parking zone with his left turn blinker on, waiting for a break in the steady stream of cyclists.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Alex Z on
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Good point regarding the right hook. There is a "bike box" at the front of all this, so perhaps a cyclist planning to continue WB on Kinzie can position himself in the box, directly in front of the cars behind him.
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Permalink Reply by Kevin C Dormant on
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At N/B Milwaukee and Elston, I preferred the position of the bike lane between auto traffic continuing straight on N/B Milwaukee and the right turn lane for Elston. Other than that, I dislike it far less than I expected. I agree that in most spots, there is ample room for faster bikes to pass slower bikes.
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Permalink Reply by Adam Herstein on
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I wasn't a fan of the buffered portions or the couple spots with bus stops, but overall I found it to be a great improvement over the previous situation. I hear CDOT will be building islands to fix the bus stop problem.
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Permalink Reply by David P. on
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I think the new NB Milwaukee/Elston arrangement seems to work fine. I go through this regularly, but I haven't yet noticed whether light cycle times are longer. Unless they are, I don't see how a wait at the new arrangement would be any longer than a wait at the old one - you are still waiting for the green to continue on Milwaukee, and for the right-turn arrow to go NB on Elston. The only potential confusion I see is whether it is permitted for cyclists to turn right on a green light with red arrow. Everything I see suggests no (basically, you follow the same rules as cars do) but the sign seems a bit ambiguous. Last time I went through there, last night, I was doing a bit of face-palming at the two or three riders ahead of me who were trying to run the red on NB Milwaukee and were getting justifiably honked at by cars that were turning onto Elston on a green arrow. Pleas follow the rules! Being predictable and following your light is safer for everybody.
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Permalink Reply by blair on
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The only problem I have with lanes like this is the risk of right hooks. Even with bright green pavement, cars have a bad habit of turning right without looking. When you're behind a line of parked cars, they don't see you.
It's how I got hit in the Kinzie PBL, and I've seen 2 cyclists almost right-hooked in the Milwaukee PBL this week.
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Pretty much agree with all of the above comments. I'm hoping that cars will stop pulling into the NB bike lane at Elston as they get used to the new configuration, and that bicyclists will stop running the red there as well. I mentioned to the CDOT folks that the bus stop at SB Milwaukee & Chicago seems to be presenting problems with vehicles turning right and buses trying to move left; hopefully they can come up with a solution for that little glitch.
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Permalink Reply by Night Owl on
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I think that the bike box at the northbound intersection of Ogden and Milwaukee could have been designed better. The box doesn't extend through the width of all three lanes and into the left turn lane, so cyclists turning left are on their own for that section. They did, however, extend it in to the car's through lane. I'm not sure why since that just encourages people to leave the PBL and head in to the lane that goes straight through the Chicago intersection. My only thought in that regard is that it is to avoid buses letting passengers off at that corner.
If that is the worst thing that happened though? Gravy.
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Permalink Reply by Mike Zumwalt on
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It's confusing and not consistent with the other bike lanes so I don't fault drivers for following the pre existing rules of the road. Cars on the right, then on the left, a dual bike lane then 2 way traffic in a left side bike lane on Dearborn. The illusion of safety is more dangerous.
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What rules of the road are you referring to, specifically?
Mike Zumwalt said:It's confusing and not consistent with the other bike lanes so I don't fault drivers for following the pre existing rules of the road. Cars on the right, then on the left, a dual bike lane then 2 way traffic in a left side bike lane on Dearborn. The illusion of safety is more dangerous.
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