Bike Lane Would Have Three-Foot Wide Curbs on Clybourn in Old Town

Plans are underway to install Chicago's first barrier protected bike lane along Clybourn Avenue in Old Town, which will serve as a test run for the city.

The proposal, presented to the public at a meeting Thursday night, included constructing a three-foot wide curb on each side of Clybourn separating the bike lane from parked cars and vehicle traffic.

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Permalink Reply by Kevin Mulcky on July 25, 2014 at 7:20am

Here Here!

Cameron 7.5 mi said:

I'm happy to read that improvements to the intersection at Division are included in this project.

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Permalink Reply by Far'arned Retrogrumpalunkus #63 on July 26, 2014 at 3:15am

If it isn't 3-feet tall as well it still isn't a "physical barrier" in my mind.

Cars can jump curbs like nobody's business. It would slow drivers a little from wandering into the segregated space, but a gross error on the part of an errant auto driver would not be prevented by a 6" curb. The many flattened road signs on the sidewalks can attest to that.

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Permalink Reply by Josh L. on July 27, 2014 at 3:49am

I know this is the area where Bobby died but my understanding is the driver was out of control. For me I find Clybourn a very safe ride and would see other locations I'd rather have protection. That being said, I do love the idea of "full protection" for riders and expect this would encourage more bike usage.

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Permalink Reply by ad on July 27, 2014 at 4:42am

Well, I guess it comes down to a question of why we build PBLs in the first place.

I don't think we can justify building them based on an argument that they will protect a cyclist from every instance of gross negligence/error on the part of an errant auto driver, as that seems to be an almost impossible goal (especially considering intersections will always remain a danger). What this type of PBL does, though, is give a cyclist a definite since of their own space that a vehicle cannot easily violate. While a car certainly could still jump a curb and hit a cyclist, I think it's reasonable to assume that the instances of a car actually doing that will likely be much, much lower than a car currently just crossing over a painted line into a bike lane. I can count on one hand the number of times I've personally seen a car jump a curb in my life, while I've seen a car cross into a painted-line bike lane (and not just to park) almost every time I've gone for a ride in the City. Gross negligence is still a danger, but you remove many of the day-to-day micro-aggressions that keep some cyclists off city streets. That seems worth it.

We don't build walls separating sidewalks from roads, yet a similar-sized curb does seem to help protect people using sidewalks outside the instances of gross negligence that you mention.

James BlackHeron said:

If it isn't 3-feet tall as well it still isn't a "physical barrier" in my mind.

Cars can jump curbs like nobody's business. It would slow drivers a little from wandering into the segregated space, but a gross error on the part of an errant auto driver would not be prevented by a 6" curb. The many flattened road signs on the sidewalks can attest to that.

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Permalink Reply by S on July 28, 2014 at 5:59am

The flattened signs are apparently mostly street cleaners wacking them. Those 3" high barriers aren't going to stop a car going at an appreciable speed unless they're pretty thick. The problem with that is then drivers will find it much harder to see cyclists at intersections. Your barriers may reduce the number of out of control cars hitting people but it'd probably increase the number of right or left hooks.

James BlackHeron said:

If it isn't 3-feet tall as well it still isn't a "physical barrier" in my mind.

Cars can jump curbs like nobody's business. It would slow drivers a little from wandering into the segregated space, but a gross error on the part of an errant auto driver would not be prevented by a 6" curb. The many flattened road signs on the sidewalks can attest to that.

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Permalink Reply by Tricolor on July 28, 2014 at 6:11am

Curbs aren't designed for a perpendicular hit; few cars encounter curbs like that, anyway.

James BlackHeron said:

If it isn't 3-feet tall as well it still isn't a "physical barrier" in my mind.

Cars can jump curbs like nobody's business. It would slow drivers a little from wandering into the segregated space, but a gross error on the part of an errant auto driver would not be prevented by a 6" curb. The many flattened road signs on the sidewalks can attest to that.

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Permalink Reply by Chitown_Mike on July 29, 2014 at 8:54am

If they do go through with this then they need to move the "Do Not Park" range at an intersection further back so peds/bikes/cars will all see each other earlier than too late. I foresee SIDSY all day long at busier intersections.

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Permalink Reply by Julie Aberman (Hochstadter) on July 31, 2014 at 4:58am

Chicagoist covers it here.

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Permalink Reply by Steve Weeks on July 31, 2014 at 9:14am

Will they be plowed in winter? Based on recent past experience with "buffered" and (post-)protected bike lanes, the answer will be "no". Then the bikes will be out in traffic in a reduced lane width.

Steve

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Permalink Reply by Steve Weeks on July 31, 2014 at 9:44am

Jackson Blvd was not plowed from Loomis to Halsted... and it's not even "protected". A couple sections of "protected" lanes (Jackson further west, and Lake Street, IIRC) I crossed were not plowed either.

Steve