The Chainlink

Anyone thinking of using studded tires this winter???

I have bike commuted through three Chicago winters and have never used studded tires. I've always found the major streets were plowed well enough to get by with my regular 26 x 1.5 slicks or 700 x 32 cross tires. Last year, however, the City plowing just really seemed to suck. I mean everyone knows the side streets were basically just left unplowed, but even the major streets seemed to get much less attention than ever before. Clearing bike lanes, or even the regular road surface, seemed to be a pretty low priority. I made it all winter without a major fall, but my fear is that with the current city budget problems and labor cut backs that the roads could be even worse this year.

Long story short, anyone on here thinking about using studded tires this winter? The Nokian 700x 32 A10's studded tires (which are designed for low rolling resistnace and use on plowed urban roads) only cost $38 a tire. Not a bad investment, but I just wonder if I am being over cautious. Just want to see what others are considering doing this year.

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Permalink Reply by Martin Hazard on November 25, 2009 at 4:30pm
I used studded tires for part of last winter, and the entire previous winter. I hate them. They are expensive, loud, heavy, and extremely slow. They will cut a third off the speed of the normal tires you described. I had swore off them after the first winter, but after the city's early season policy of "not doing a god damn thing" about side streets I resurrected them for awhile. I will keep a beater bike set up with them this year, but conditions are rare where they are an advantage. They also limited my mileage to about 10 miles before my knees got sore. They are horrible in actual snow, your slicks will do much better. If you do try them don't fall for the myth that you only need a front. Once your back tire slides out far enough, the front will follow.
Permalink Reply by Tony Adams on November 25, 2009 at 6:35pm
Daley admitted that last winter's snow removal was a failure and claims it won't happen again. The City plans to try some technical innovations to improve snow removal, and perhaps more importantly, there will be overtime for crews - which was what created the problem last winter. Here is a piece from the Sun Times: City using technology to remove snow, avoid blowing budget

But of course, we won't know how it goes until we get some big snow. But even considering how bad it was last year, I don't plan on trying studded tires. My bike is already loud, heavy and extremely slow!
Permalink Reply by Joe Studer 8.0 mi on November 25, 2009 at 8:26pm
Last winter I ran the Nokians you're thinking about. They are nice, and a steal at $38.

There are a number of threads in the Chainlink that discuss studded tires in some depth, and they have a lot of good information.

Know that the studded tires will affect your rolling resistance. If the studs are going to help you at all, you typically need to run a lower psi (e.g., something lower than 50 psi). And studs are really only necessary if you are going to be running into ice. They are not necessary (nor particularly helpful) for just snow.

I'm with Brian on the sound; I think they sound cool when they are rolling along. People will definitely hear you coming.

I'm running the Schwalbe Marathon Winter's this year, but on separate wheels that I only plan on swapping in on days where I expect to run into ice. Otherwise, I plan on running my normal commuters.
Permalink Reply by ishnock aka the blue baron on November 25, 2009 at 9:13pm
Sheldon Brown says no.

Last year,I road on 700x25 and never had an issue. My tires had some nice grooves on them so the treaded extremely well.You want the tires to have as much contact as possible with the ground,
and studded tires do not allow that. It's not like the streets are going
going to be like off road trails,where the ground is muddy,softy and
uneven.

It's like an eraser on a pencil.the rubber needs to have as much contact with the paper in order to have the necessary friction to erase the mark.

Look into some Continental Gator tires or some Michelin
detonators......those are all year around tires that are built
to handle all seasons and all road conditions
Permalink Reply by David Travis on November 25, 2009 at 11:42pm
Three years of commuting in winter with studded tires and the only slippage I experienced was from snow over 4 inches deep. They work. Remember it really is not if but when you will hit ice you didn't see, especially getting home in the dark.
Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on November 26, 2009 at 11:24am
Studded tires are not for mud and uneven terrain, they are for ice.

I have never had them on a bike but I have run studded tires on motorcycles and studded tracks on sleds and in my opinion if you need traction on ice there is NOTHING better out there then studs.

However, they suck on anything that is not ice and you get the added joy of wearing out something really expensive that is actually doing more harm then good when you ride them off the ice.


ishnock aka the blue baron said:
Sheldon Brown says no.

It's not like the streets are going
going to be like off road trails,where the ground is muddy,softy and
uneven.
Permalink Reply by J on November 26, 2009 at 12:53pm
I agree that those of you considering studded tires should read through the archived posts.

One point I'd like to make however is that because studded tires are such a niche, very few people have tried them, and those who have, probably haven't tried more than one design -- so anecdotal evidence isn't as useful in this case as it might be with other topics. This does not even take into account the very different road conditions found within the Chicago area. In my neighborhood, due to poor drainage and other factors, black ice accumulates to the point where road tires just don't work. It is true the 23/25c tires sink through the snow, but if you're hitting ice (rather than tarmac or dirt) below -- they just won't work.

So understand that there are several different types of studded tires on the market. Some are based on (rubber) studded MTB and cross tires -- these are wide and aggressive and meant for running at lower pressures. Others are based on high end commuting tires, and can be run at higher pressures on the road.
Permalink Reply by Norm Hansen on November 29, 2009 at 10:27pm
I have found that whatever tire you use lower presser is best. A high pressure tire is hard and fast. A lower pressure tire will have more contact.

Permalink Reply by David P. on December 1, 2009 at 9:11pm
My first reaction was "where are you finding Nokian A10s for $38??" Then I remembered that 650b tires always seem to be more expensive.

+2 on reviewing past threads on the subject. You can do fine without them but they're great for the worst 15% of winter days and for peace of mind, so if you can swing buying a set, why not try them? I used W106s last winter and found them to work very well on the iciness I did ride on, fine in deep snow (about the same as my regular tires at the time) and good enough on dry pavement.

Now I have 700c W106s but no suitable 700c bike to put them on, and a desire for either 650b or 26" studded tires for this winter.

David
Permalink Reply by h' Zerocats on December 1, 2009 at 10:39pm
Now that everyone has spoken out against them, I have no choice-- I must have some.
Who's got a cheap source?

David A. Pertuz said:
My first reaction was "where are you finding Nokian A10s for $38??" Then I remembered that 650b tires always seem to be more expensive.

+2 on reviewing past threads on the subject. You can do fine without them but they're great for the worst 15% of winter days and for peace of mind, so if you can swing buying a set, why not try them? I used W106s last winter and found them to work very well on the iciness I did ride on, fine in deep snow (about the same as my regular tires at the time) and good enough on dry pavement.

Now I have 700c W106s but no suitable 700c bike to put them on, and a desire for either 650b or 26" studded tires for this winter.

David
Permalink Reply by Glenn on December 2, 2009 at 12:24pm
I have never used studded tires, though i think it would be kool to. Ill prolly stuck with the reg tires and maybe add some improvised tire "chains" if the ice gets really bad.
where i live they don't plow till after the storm and there is always a layer of ice on everything, and I get by without them. Of course Iv eat'n my share of snow though
Permalink Reply by Chucko on December 2, 2009 at 12:48pm
I have a spare fixed gear beater that I have studded tires on- the Nokian's you mentioned. They're a must for low snowfall days (when it only snows an inch but the cars pack it down into ice) or for those days between when it snows and when it thaws enough to clear the roads. Definitely feel safer with them. Kind of like the difference between walking on ice, and walking on ice that's been sprinkled with sand. Still not foolproof, but much much better traction.

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