Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Chris on October 8, 2008 at 2:37am

I would never think its sAfer to ride brakeless its just simpler, cheaper, and largely if you're trying to pull off alot of tricks having a brake attached prevents you from doin bar spins. i ride with front brakes on both my bikes but when you ride brakeless it kinda makes you ride safer cuz you know you've got less of a safety net so you take more precaution in your riding. i have alot of friends who ride fixed/brakeless/clipless so you gotta be on point when you ride like that for sure.

Permalink Reply by Gelacio on October 9, 2008 at 3:24am

I ride fixed/brakeless/clipless cause its just the way I learned

Permalink Reply by root on October 9, 2008 at 7:28am

each of my fixed gears has a brake. i wouldn't even consider taking it off at this point. it's a speed thing, really. i like to go fast and stop on a dime

when i get a dead straight fork i'm sure it'll come off from time to time - but for trick practice and that's it.

Permalink Reply by Danielle on October 17, 2008 at 8:25am

but you don't think it's essential for the city? People ride safer than that on the track. How do you stop in the rain? when my shoes are wet, they seem to slip around a bit more but I just fall into my toe clips.

Gelacio said:

I ride fixed/brakeless/clipless cause its just the way I learned

Permalink Reply by The Nefarious Dinosaur Patrol on November 3, 2008 at 7:51pm

I did a year of commuting in traffic with no brake; I'm adding one now. I think brakeless makes for more fluid, concentrated riding, but after being almost hit numerous times by random drivers blowing through red lights or fast cutting into parking spaces, I think that other people's incompetence is going to kill me soon and that the extra half second faster a brake will help me stop will be worth it.

But I've ridden two centuries brakeless, and carried an entire thanksgiving dinner in the pouring rain while skiddin' around town and I'll damnsure miss it...

Permalink Reply by Brett Ratner on December 21, 2008 at 8:18pm

I agree that brakeless encourages the rider to truly be aware of his/her surroundings, to ride cautiously, and to anticipate the flow of traffic. Having a brake can allow the rider to be more lazy and less observant. And for that reason, one could argue that you're safer on a brakeless bike.

However, there is no disputing that you get much more braking power from the front tire than you do the rear. If you need proof, look at any modern motorcycle and notice how the front wheel has a huge disk brake (often two huge disk brakes) while the rear wheel has one small disk (or sometimes drum) brake. In motorcycle Grand Prix races, the riders barely touch the rear brake, only to occasionally settle the suspension when entering a high-speed corner.

I rode around brakeless for a few weeks, but what convinced me to install a front brake was a rumor that I had heard. I heard that insurance companies might try to deny your claim if you are injured in a crash and they somehow discover that you were riding a bike with no brake. I haven't verified this, but it's not something I want to risk.

If anyone knows if this rumor is true or not, I'd love to hear about it!

Permalink Reply by Danielle on December 21, 2008 at 9:09pm

This Rumor is indeed true. If you are in an accident and you are riding brakeless, they could put the blame on you, and you could even face a counter suit.

Brett Ratner said:

I agree that brakeless encourages the rider to truly be aware of his/her surroundings, to ride cautiously, and to anticipate the flow of traffic. Having a brake can allow the rider to be more lazy and less observant. And for that reason, one could argue that you're safer on a brakeless bike.

However, there is no disputing that you get much more braking power from the front tire than you do the rear. If you need proof, look at any modern motorcycle and notice how the front wheel has a huge disk brake (often two huge disk brakes) while the rear wheel has one small disk (or sometimes drum) brake. In motorcycle Grand Prix races, the riders barely touch the rear brake, only to occasionally settle the suspension when entering a high-speed corner.

I rode around brakeless for a few weeks, but what convinced me to install a front brake was a rumor that I had heard. I heard that insurance companies might try to deny your claim if you are injured in a crash and they somehow discover that you were riding a bike with no brake. I haven't verified this, but it's not something I want to risk.

If anyone knows if this rumor is true or not, I'd love to hear about it!

Permalink Reply by GabeW (not the other Gabe) on January 6, 2009 at 8:55am

This is what the law says:

(c) Every bicycle shall be equipped with a brake which will adequately control movement of and stop and hold such bicycle.
taken from: http://www.dot.state.il.us/bikemap/bikelaw.htm

You could argue that since the actual brake mechanism isn't defined (such as a cantilever that pinches the rim, or a disk and rotor, or drum and rotor, or your foot on the ground, or a stick through the spokes) your fixed chain does adequately control movement and stop and hold such bicycle. However, you'd probably still be banging your head against a wall trying to convince your insurance or a judge of that. I don't want to stop all the time under leg power alone, and I don't want to argue with insurance over parts of my broken mangled bike, so front brakes makes sense for me.
Danielle said:

This Rumor is indeed true. If you are in an accident and you are riding brakeless, they could put the blame on you, and you could even face a counter suit.

Brett Ratner said:

I agree that brakeless encourages the rider to truly be aware of his/her surroundings, to ride cautiously, and to anticipate the flow of traffic. Having a brake can allow the rider to be more lazy and less observant. And for that reason, one could argue that you're safer on a brakeless bike.

However, there is no disputing that you get much more braking power from the front tire than you do the rear. If you need proof, look at any modern motorcycle and notice how the front wheel has a huge disk brake (often two huge disk brakes) while the rear wheel has one small disk (or sometimes drum) brake. In motorcycle Grand Prix races, the riders barely touch the rear brake, only to occasionally settle the suspension when entering a high-speed corner.

I rode around brakeless for a few weeks, but what convinced me to install a front brake was a rumor that I had heard. I heard that insurance companies might try to deny your claim if you are injured in a crash and they somehow discover that you were riding a bike with no brake. I haven't verified this, but it's not something I want to risk.

If anyone knows if this rumor is true or not, I'd love to hear about it!

Permalink Reply by A.I. Kay on January 7, 2009 at 9:34am

I'm inclined to think that the drive train doesn't count as a braking mechanism because it doesn't by design prevent the wheel from entering into motion from a stopped position (not even really in a trackstand). Not that this is the most important feature of brakes on a bike, but it's one of the things that brakes typically do.

I keep a front brake on my bike and nearly never use it. I can understand how no brakes might be appealing for some folks who want to learn to ride with a fluid cadence, since its awfully tempting to pull the lever, but I just can't believe that it's safe. I guess the bottom line is I just wouldn't want to be without the one time I might need it. But Brett makes a good point - people rely too much on their brakes as their sole safety mechanism...it's just as, if not more, important to learn safe commuting and emergency techniques as it is to be able to stop.

Permalink Reply by GabeW (not the other Gabe) on January 7, 2009 at 10:10am

True, it's a stretch to say that a fixed drivetrain is a brake, but remember - if you let go of your brake lever, you stop braking - it's a "simple machine" (a cantilever). Your drivetrain is a "simple machine" too (sprockets and chain). If it's a fixed system, your leg pressure on the pedal is as much of an engagement as your fingers on a brake lever. And both slow you and stop you. If you're trackstanding, aren't you held in that position by engaging the chain and sprocket mechanism?

I'm not trying to be argumentative amongst a group of us that all pretty much seem to be on the same page as far as keeping a front brake is concerned, I just think debating the law and it's shortcoming/loopholes/unnecessary lawsuits is kinda interesting. I mean really - when do you need a brake to hold you stopped? I just put my foot down once I've come to a stop. It's not like we have engines and automatic transmissions that will start us creeping forward once we release the brake. The only scenario I can come up with for when you would need extra help staying stopped is if someone was pushing you, and thats illegal on the part of the pusher, not the pushee.
I agree totally with AI and Brett - bike handling is just as if not more important that getting yourself stopped.

Has anyone actually found themselves in trouble for not having brakes? Just curious.

Permalink Reply by GabeW (not the other Gabe) on January 7, 2009 at 10:20am

Oh- and one aside:
The only accident I've been in was when I was riding my trek 930 flat out down a slight hill on Lake street in evanston approaching Ridge. When I got into the intersection an oncoming car turned left and I went right up onto the hood and windshield still clipped in to the pedals.

I never had time to grab the brakes.

Permalink Reply by Danielle on January 19, 2009 at 6:19pm

Eek...were you ok? I always here about people getting hit clipped in. One accident was really nasty, the other, not so much because instinctively he clipped out before the real damage.

GabeW said:

Oh- and one aside:
The only accident I've been in was when I was riding my trek 930 flat out down a slight hill on Lake street in evanston approaching Ridge. When I got into the intersection an oncoming car turned left and I went right up onto the hood and windshield still clipped in to the pedals.

I never had time to grab the brakes.

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