The Chainlink

It's mostly because we get paid bullshit.

Seriously, do you have any idea how annoying it is to get bitched at about the cost of a tune up when you don't make shit?

Views: 4624

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Moving on to your other points: they're good points, what else can I say? It's not that I think you're right in your criticism of how resources are allocated, it's just that I don't think you're necessarily wrong. I think we'd end up debating the merits of markets versus central planning which is just a never-ending debate. So as usual I respectfully disagree. I do appreciate your points.



Davo said:

I figured you'd like that. Econ minor here. Anyhoo back on topic….

Tom Dworzanski said:

Lol Zing!

Davo said:

You must be getting an amazing invisible hand job


Hehe, he says auto nipple tightening machine while sounding so proper. 


notoriousDUG said:

Serious human skill huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRYEv2NDdzE

Maybe you should stick to talking about things you actually know about, eh?


Yes, someone physically feeds the spokes of every wheel built into the rim. Yes, every well-trued wheel is trued by hand (unless it happens to be perfect by chance). I know you know the latter.


Why do you act like you have some sort of superior knowledge to guard as if you're some sort of fourteenth century stonemason?



notoriousDUG said:

My anger comes from the fact that you are being willfully ignorant here.  

Machine built wheels are a thing and almost all stock wheels on bikes are machine built as are most replacement wheels sold in bike shops. 

Do you really think there is somebody hand building all of the wheels that go onto box store bikes?

Why is it that you presume to know more about this than somebody who actually works in the industry?


Tom Dworzanski said:

Thanks for going out of your way to find what the video claims to be "the only" automated truing machine that automates the tasks of wheel building. I guess you can find any scam online. Notice how they instantly cite the machine's limitations and then spend just as much time promoting the manual high quality machine. And of course it has automated wheel rejection as a major feature because it needs an excuse for when it doesn't get lucky. Also all the human labor installing spokes just goes to prove my point.

None of this matters anyway because you know it takes skill to true a wheel precisely (you made the point several times yesterday) and you're just interested in arguing with me.

I'm sorry that you ignore the points I'm making and just focus on nitpicking little statements out of context over and over. Life must suck having so much anger that it comes out in this way. I hope you figure that out.


notoriousDUG said:

Serious human skill huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRYEv2NDdzE

Maybe you should stick to talking about things you actually know about, eh?

Tom Dworzanski said:

Just that they seem to specialize in building high quality wheels. They were the first two links on Google. I don't know anything else about them.

I guess I'm also trying to gently imply that specializing in wheels is one way to earn more money in the cycling industry since it's impossible to automate and requires serious human skill (art).


ilter said:

Tom, what's special about these two stores that linked to?


Tom Dworzanski said:

[snip]

I do agree with you that there is an art to building and truing wheels. A few people (one two) specialize in it.

Lacing a wheel and doing a final true on a machine is not exactly what I would call skilled labor, it is basic assembly like manufacturing work.

There are wheels that are not hand finished and simply sent off to be distributed; but what do I know I only work in the industry.


Tom Dworzanski said:

Yes, someone physically feeds the spokes of every wheel built into the rim. Yes, every well-trued wheel is trued by hand (unless it happens to be perfect by chance). I know you know the latter.


Why do you act like you have some sort of superior knowledge to guard as if you're some sort of fourteenth century stonemason?



notoriousDUG said:

My anger comes from the fact that you are being willfully ignorant here.  

Machine built wheels are a thing and almost all stock wheels on bikes are machine built as are most replacement wheels sold in bike shops. 

Do you really think there is somebody hand building all of the wheels that go onto box store bikes?

Why is it that you presume to know more about this than somebody who actually works in the industry?


Tom Dworzanski said:

Thanks for going out of your way to find what the video claims to be "the only" automated truing machine that automates the tasks of wheel building. I guess you can find any scam online. Notice how they instantly cite the machine's limitations and then spend just as much time promoting the manual high quality machine. And of course it has automated wheel rejection as a major feature because it needs an excuse for when it doesn't get lucky. Also all the human labor installing spokes just goes to prove my point.

None of this matters anyway because you know it takes skill to true a wheel precisely (you made the point several times yesterday) and you're just interested in arguing with me.

I'm sorry that you ignore the points I'm making and just focus on nitpicking little statements out of context over and over. Life must suck having so much anger that it comes out in this way. I hope you figure that out.


notoriousDUG said:

Serious human skill huh?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRYEv2NDdzE

Maybe you should stick to talking about things you actually know about, eh?

Tom Dworzanski said:

Just that they seem to specialize in building high quality wheels. They were the first two links on Google. I don't know anything else about them.

I guess I'm also trying to gently imply that specializing in wheels is one way to earn more money in the cycling industry since it's impossible to automate and requires serious human skill (art).


ilter said:

Tom, what's special about these two stores that linked to?


Tom Dworzanski said:

[snip]

I do agree with you that there is an art to building and truing wheels. A few people (one two) specialize in it.

Lovely- Tom D. said "Why do you act like you have some sort of superior knowledge to guard as if you're some sort of fourteenth century stonemason?"  

Low pay is one of the factors that contributes to stress.  Stress can contribute to being grumpy. 

I didn't see this pointed out, so just wanted to mention it.

Personally- I get grumpy at work, sometimes, but try to push that feeling aside.  I feel bad when customers see the grump.

Hello and here we go:

a lot of you may know me out here I've been working at a shop in Chicago for over 4 decades and have heard and seen some of everything out there. IMO bicycle mechanics can have your life at their hands when it comes to repairing or assembling  your bike. a TRUE bicycle mechanic has,or should have, pride in his or her work I have seen over many years where a customer has had their bike worked on at a shop of their choice and then went to another one for the same problem which should have been fixed by the first one.I tend to agree that TRUE bicycle mechanics are under paid for the work that they do while having pride while they do it, on the other hand I understand also why some owners of shops do not pay their mechanics higher wages I have seen work from a lot of shops over the years and a lot of it just blows my mind.you need these days mechanically inclined managers as well as mechanics and owners should be also.Paying higher wages to mechanics should be given depending on their level of skill and timing of repairs. And I will add this good piece of advice to all of you who have your bikes worked on at shops,Do you REALLY know who's working on your bike? maybe you may want to check that out before you just go to any shop or even your local one,how long have those guys been working on bikes?

i'll also admit that, I don't know everything myself,with all of the new stuff that has come out over the years, but if you're good at what you do know just have pride in doing what you're good at.

I'm more wondering if the DUG got himself shot?  He went from mighty a tizzy to stone silent pretty quick.

He's probably working (as a bike mechanic!) or something and doesn't obsessively comment on Chainlink every second of every day.

Go for a bike ride and stop trying to make trouble.  Sheesh.

There isn't anybody to argue with right now...

I notice you haven't given any details on how a shop tried to rip you off or answered any of the pricing questions I asked...


Haddon said:

I'm more wondering if the DUG got himself shot?  He went from mighty a tizzy to stone silent pretty quick.

There are economic issues in the bike industry that mirror other industries, too.  The American consumer drives prices lower on the vast majority of bikes that are sold in big box stores.  Too many consumers (not generally the people reading forums like this one) buy whatever bike they can get cheapest, which is why the vast majority of wheels are built by machine and shipped still needing to be trued.  Big box stores don't commit that the bike is going to work 100% properly when you buy it, but when you bring that same bike into your LBS, their commitment to serving customers well demands that they make that bike ride perfectly - otherwise their reputation as being a serious cycling shop will suffer.

Dura Ace quality bikes are easy to work on.  A mechanic with some practice can assemble such a bike quickly and easily (with a few exceptions like internal cable routing).  The big box bike takes real mechanical skill to make it work, often requiring, as an example, front derailleurs to be bent into shape to make the shifting work well.  Hence, a top mechanic is needed to work on the big box bike, while a newer mechanic can assemble a new Dura Ace bike from the box.

Yet the customer with the big box bike is much more likely to be the one that is upset by an expensive repair quote, saying "well I could buy a new bike for $X, why should I pay for this repair?"  And the bike gets thrown out.

The bicycle industry is not the only one with this problem.  Try finding anyone to repair a toaster or a big box brand vacuum cleaner.  We are becoming a disposable society.  A good LBS is a holdout against this trend, but it's an uphill fight.

The poster who discussed charging more to replace the battery in a Rolex watch than in a Timex is on to something.  The airline industry is masterful at charging different customers different prices for the same service (seats in the same row), but the bike industry struggles with this, especially when the cost to repair the big box bike is more than the cost to repair the expensive one.

Notorious DUG's shop may lose money on the 75 cheap bikes he repairs and makes money on the nice one that follows.  So, some LBSs refuse to repair big box bikes, but that only alienates entry level cyclists.  We need to bring those customers in and educate them ... but that's not easy either.

These dynamics are what makes it hard to earn a good living repairing bikes, IMHO.

It's really not worth the bother, any of it. 

notoriousDUG said:

There isn't anybody to argue with right now...

I notice you haven't given any details on how a shop tried to rip you off or answered any of the pricing questions I asked...


Haddon said:

I'm more wondering if the DUG got himself shot?  He went from mighty a tizzy to stone silent pretty quick.

RSS

© 2008-2016   The Chainlink Community, L.L.C.   Powered by

Disclaimer  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service