The Chainlink

Kinzie. It's what's next.

Hopefully you've heard by now that CDOT will begin construction this week on the city's first protected bike lane: Kinzie Street from Milwaukee Avenue/Desplaines Street to Wells Street. 

 

Full story on Steven Can Plan. 

 

I want to know what you think about this.

  • What do you feel will need special attention?
  • Is this the right or wrong location for such a facility? Why?
  • Are you going to thank/congratulate Rahm, Gabe, and the CDOT Bicycle Program?
  • Will you use it?

 

Cycle track and protected bike lane naysayers, this isn't the post for you. But if you've ridden in protected bike lanes before, then I welcome your constructive comments and criticism based on your actual experiences. 

Big intersection

The new beginning. Looking southeast at the intersection of Kinzie/Milwaukee/Desplaines. 

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by milesperhour on July 21, 2011 at 9:42am
Question re: cars and postal trucks parked in the protected bike lane, couldn't the city just put up the soft bollards at the beginning and end of the bike lane whenever it meets an intersection?  Bikes could still get around them, but cars couldn't.  Would that be deemed to dangerous for bicyclists?
Permalink Reply by vxla on July 21, 2011 at 9:49am

Travis Kluska writes..

"1st stop light there was a green right arrow at a red. 1st stop sign no one present. 2nd stop sign traffic had passed and no people were crossing. 3rd stop sign cars had passed and none were present thereafter."

 

Did you sound your bell to the car making a left turn from Kinzie to Des Plaines? You know, that car stopped and had the right-of-way.

Permalink Reply by igz on July 21, 2011 at 9:49am

i may applaud the effort of protected lanes, but when everyone is digging deep in their pockets to provide cyclists with such an infrastructure, it would be wise to assess the faults in the design before executing such an expensive experiment. otherwise, we risk loosing the effort altogether stating 'it was a dumb idea, an expensive dumb idea'.

 

and like others pointed out, if you are going to use this - essentially gift to the cycling community - use it with a little more respect.

 

if you want to blow the rules of the road at midnight when few are around, have fun. but at mid day traffic both vehicular and pedestrian, thats a bit reckless.

 

oh, and that first arrow...it a green arrow to proceed right, not across the intersection. that is a very dangerous 6-way intersection with blind corners and inclines.


Travis Kluska said:

1st stop light there was a green right arrow at a red. 1st stop sign no one present. 2nd stop sign traffic had passed and no people were crossing. 3rd stop sign cars had passed and none were present thereafter. 4th stop sign I should have stopped but the sign was covered by the tree and I slowly went around the construction workers. 5th stop sign no cars or peds present. 6th stop sign seems not to apply to bicyclists because there are no car lanes or sidewalks that intersect. 2nd set of stoplights I yielded for traffic and a bicyclists to go by and then crossed when there was no one else. Then the protected Kinzie lane ended and I almost got doored and had to narrowly weave in between traffic. I know Kinzie is not perfect but its a solid step in the right direction and its fine to talk about its flaws but to say its worthless is ridiculous.
Permalink Reply by Brendan Kevenides on July 21, 2011 at 10:00am

Thanks for posting that video.  You must not be too surprised to receive some criticism for how you rode the bike lane.  However, I've ridden the cycle track many times now and the way you did it is mostly consistent with the way I've seen the average bicyclist use it since its completion.  (I suppose the only exception I'd make is your running the light at Milwaukee and Kinzie.  Most cyclists seem to be obeying the law there.)  I think your video is more valuable because you filmed it the way you did.  Had you stopped at every sign and every crosswalk it simply would not be an accurate depiction of how Kinzie is being used.

 

The law requires bicyclists to stop at all traffic control devices just like cars.  I think we all know that. But if we are honest with each other we'd have to admit that we all are selective about stopping at stop signs.  Right or wrong, it is the rare bicyclists who stops completely at every sign/light, every time.  The law should recognize how real people ride -- rather than how we wish they rode -- in our vehicle code (treat stop as yield), and urban planners should appreciate that in how they design bicycle specific infrastructure.

 

Travis, I do not agree with your statement that, "People still have the option of bicycling with traffic on Kinzie as well."  In my opinion, they do not: http://www.mybikeadvocate.com/2011/06/chicagos-new-cycle-track-will...

Travis Kluska said:

I think its unfair to expect bicyclists to stop at every stop sign and light when there is no traffic or peds present. I yield but do not see the need to stop for everything. This is working and is just .5 of a 100 miles of protected lanes to be built in the next 4 years. Its going to get better. I think Kinzie is great, not scary, and am glad that more lanes are on the way. Scary is driving on the streets with no lanes whatsoever. Lets not be haters and see everything thats bad about this protected bike lane. Children and the elderly will feel much more comfortable on Kinzie now than it was before. People still have the option of bicycling with traffic on Kinzie as well.
Permalink Reply by Dr. Doom on July 21, 2011 at 10:01am
That's a really good idea. Forest Preserve District trails have hard steel signs up at intersections to prevent car access and I can't see how bollards would be more dangerous than those.

milesperhour said:
Question re: cars and postal trucks parked in the protected bike lane, couldn't the city just put up the soft bollards at the beginning and end of the bike lane whenever it meets an intersection?  Bikes could still get around them, but cars couldn't.  Would that be deemed to dangerous for bicyclists?
Permalink Reply by ad on July 21, 2011 at 10:25am

Out of curiosity, what time of day are people riding the cycle track and seeing a bunch of people blocking or using it as a sidewalk??

I've been riding it east during my commute every weekday since it opened (so between 8:45 to 9 usually) and I think I've only ever seen four or five people (besides constructions workers actually working on it or the road itself) ever walking in it during that time frame.  And even on those occasions, the track is more than wide enough that I easily just went around them after an "on your left" shout-out.  I take a different route home, so not sure what it's like heading west during the evening rush.   

Not saying peds are not/never a problem at other times during the day, but this just hasn't been my experience when I've been using it so far.   

Permalink Reply by igz on July 21, 2011 at 10:42am
this would also force bikes to slow down when approaching an intersection.  i like it

Dr. Doom said:
That's a really good idea. Forest Preserve District trails have hard steel signs up at intersections to prevent car access and I can't see how bollards would be more dangerous than those.

milesperhour said:
Question re: cars and postal trucks parked in the protected bike lane, couldn't the city just put up the soft bollards at the beginning and end of the bike lane whenever it meets an intersection?  Bikes could still get around them, but cars couldn't.  Would that be deemed to dangerous for bicyclists?
Permalink Reply by Carter O'Brien on July 21, 2011 at 10:53am

The bike infrastructure isn't the problem, the cyclist failing to even slow down before blowing through a major intersection's red light is the glaring problem.  Compounding that is passing the cyclist - properly stopped in the bike box - on the right. 

 

Dude - please don't pass fellow cyclists (or buses, or cars in a right turn lane) on the right.  Ever.  This is basic rules-of-the-road stuff, and a behavioral problem which is becoming so common place on Milwaukee Avenue that newbies are starting to think it's normal & proper.  Which it is most certainly not.

 

IMO it would be wise simply out of self-interest to at least slow down when going through stop signs, but the stop signs multiplied like bunnies over the past 25 years thanks to reckless drivers, not cyclists.  I don't have time to watch the whole video, but I didn't see any reckless biking in the sense he's actually cutting off any pedestrians or cars, he simply isn't prepared to stop if something out of the ordinary happens, which isn't a sustainable cycling strategy in congested parts of Chicago. 

 

Kevin Conway said:

Looks like an accurate representation of what I see every morning on the protected bike lane-run 4 stop signs, 4 stop lights and fail to yield the right of way to cars and pedestrians. Should be a short-lived experiment in bicycle infrastructure.

Travis Kluska said:
Permalink Reply by Carter O'Brien on July 21, 2011 at 11:01am

I agree with you to a large extent on stop signs as long as you do what you say and yield right of way if cars/pedestrians/cyclists are present.

 

I disagree as regards traffic lights, at least during normal day time hours (3 am is a different story).

 

That is a very slippery slope to head down, as what defines "no traffic present" is extremely subjective - is it a car that you can beat to/through the intersection?  A car that's xxx feet away?  Cars can go from zero to 60 very quickly.

 

I fully agree the Kinzie is a very positive step.  I didn't see anything in the beginning of that video that I haven't seen on steroids on every other major street in Chicago, it's going to take some time for people to get the message - in the meantime, cyclists should if anything be behaving extra-squeaky clean as far as rules of the road, as we're being scrutinized now.


Travis Kluska said:

I think its unfair to expect bicyclists to stop at every stop sign and light when there is no traffic or peds present. I yield but do not see the need to stop for everything. This is working and is just .5 of a 100 miles of protected lanes to be built in the next 4 years. Its going to get better. I think Kinzie is great, not scary, and am glad that more lanes are on the way. Scary is driving on the streets with no lanes whatsoever. Lets not be haters and see everything thats bad about this protected bike lane. Children and the elderly will feel much more comfortable on Kinzie now than it was before. People still have the option of bicycling with traffic on Kinzie as well.
Permalink Reply by Steven Vance on July 21, 2011 at 11:07am

If you want the situation to be changed or improved, I suggest you inform those who have the authority to change them. If you want help in contacting these people, you can message me privately via email. 

Permalink Reply by Elihu Blanks on July 21, 2011 at 11:23am

Well listen guys this is a great lane for everyone to enjoy. There are too many of us to agree to what riding the "correct" way (however this is) is. I think this is why we have a government to govern what is "correct" and punish what isn't "correct".

 

Therefore, I think the next step is for someone to get hurt in these 100 miles of new road, everyone get upset (driver, bikers, peds, etc...), legislation be passed that makes bikers have to get bike plates, etc... and tickets be issued for our breaking the laws. Then it become our decission if we're willing to risk our lives and driving records, creditability, etc...

 

You may not want to hear this but it makes since to me that the city, state or fed would like to make a little more revenue by placing requirements on bikers and issuing tickets for our errors.

 

Either way I think we'll be ok you just make the best decission keeps you from being that biker who caused the world to change.

 

Riding Over Adversity...

Permalink Reply by Steven Vance on July 21, 2011 at 11:32am

I think commenters on this discussion should be more worried about where CDOT plans the next 24.5 miles. At the June MBAC, Bicycle Program Coordinator Ben Gomberg said that the first 25 miles of protected bike lanes has "already been assessed" and "will be done right away."

 

Without. Public. Input.

 

The next 75 miles will apparently be decided by the new "Streets for Cycling Plan," or I've also heard it described as the Bike 2020 Plan. Mark de la Vergne of Sam Schwartz Engineering will be leading the creation of this plan. It will "obviously" include public meetings and involvement. 

I wrote about this on Steven Can Plan.

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