I run red lights. There, I said it.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on
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I think that is a little upsetting that you, as an attorney, failed to note or point out that regardless of your justification for running a traffic light or sign it is still illegal and punishable via citation and fine. Not to mention that if you choose to disobey a traffic control and end up in an accident, regardless of the other party's level of malice or stupidity, you are going to be viewed as in the wrong and probably have no recourse when it comes to getting compensated for the damages even if it could be argued the other person was at fault.
And for the record; I run lights and signs for the same reason you do but I recognize the legal position it puts me in and choose to not advertise or publicly justify my actions because I do not want to give people the impression they are in the right to do so.
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Permalink Reply by heather s on
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"I do not do it to simply thumb my nose at the law; and let me be clear, in Illinois running red lights and stop signs on a bicycle is against the law. Bicyclists in Chicago can and do get ticketed for doing so." That was in the first paragraph.
notoriousDUG said:I think that is a little upsetting that you, as an attorney, failed to note or point out that regardless of your justification for running a traffic light or sign it is still illegal and punishable via citation and fine. Not to mention that if you choose to disobey a traffic control and end up in an accident, regardless of the other party's level of malice or stupidity, you are going to be viewed as in the wrong and probably have no recourse when it comes to getting compensated for the damages even if it could be argued the other person was at fault.
And for the record; I run lights and signs for the same reason you do but I recognize the legal position it puts me in and choose to not advertise or publicly justify my actions because I do not want to give people the impression they are in the right to do so.
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Permalink Reply by Digital Dario on
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Interesting perspective. Honestly, I do the same thing. The key here is to understand that one does this within reason. That is of course unless you have some sort of death wish.
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Permalink Reply by mike w. on
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To echo, amplify, and clarify...
i am a bit like n. DUG as to the legal responsibility thing. i recognise and have said before that if i get my clock cleaned whilst doing something illegal or ill-advised, it's my own damn' fault, and i hope to all that's holy that i'm not a role model to any who are easily led astray - but i do run lights & stops when it benefits. If i fully stopped at every sign and light on my commute, it'd probably take 3 hours instead of 45m... i tend to treat stop signs as "yield" and reds as options if there aren't a lot of witnesses.
so sue me.
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Permalink Reply by Brendan Kevenides on
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DUG: Please see Heather Stratton's response. I wrote that post because I wish to advocate for a change in the law. Will my little post on my little blog have an impact? Almost certainly not, but change is a process. It has to start somewhere. Cyclists that run lights are often scoffed at as arrogant outlaws. That, in my view, is unfair. There are legitimate reasons for not following the rules of the road when biking in traffic.
notoriousDUG said:I think that is a little upsetting that you, as an attorney, failed to note or point out that regardless of your justification for running a traffic light or sign it is still illegal and punishable via citation and fine. Not to mention that if you choose to disobey a traffic control and end up in an accident, regardless of the other party's level of malice or stupidity, you are going to be viewed as in the wrong and probably have no recourse when it comes to getting compensated for the damages even if it could be argued the other person was at fault.
And for the record; I run lights and signs for the same reason you do but I recognize the legal position it puts me in and choose to not advertise or publicly justify my actions because I do not want to give people the impression they are in the right to do so.
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Permalink Reply by Anne on
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but what if i'm riding a bike through an intersection on the green and you run the red?
as a cyclist, i'd like everyone to obey the traffic rules, then we can all safely arrive at our destinations.
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Most responsible cyclists who run reds do so when there is no one coming. We look out for other cyclists.
Anne said:but what if i'm riding a bike through an intersection on the green and you run the red?
as a cyclist, i'd like everyone to obey the traffic rules, then we can all safely arrive at our destinations.
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Charging through an intersection without looking for bikes and motor vehicles is stupid. Slowing down, looking then going when the coast is clear is sometimes reasonable.
Anne said:but what if i'm riding a bike through an intersection on the green and you run the red?
as a cyclist, i'd like everyone to obey the traffic rules, then we can all safely arrive at our destinations.
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funny, i've almost been hit by two cyclists charging thru an intersection this year who were seemingly trying to obtain that cocoon of urban space and serenity.
my motto is "anticipate ignorance, expect stupidity". While I would trust you, or others on this board, perhaps, to NOT be stupid, I have a profound lack of trust in the greater demographic of road users (and that includes pedestrians!)
Chicago Bicycle Advocate said:Charging through an intersection without looking for bikes and motor vehicles is stupid. Slowing down, looking then going when the coast is clear is sometimes reasonable.
Anne said:but what if i'm riding a bike through an intersection on the green and you run the red?
as a cyclist, i'd like everyone to obey the traffic rules, then we can all safely arrive at our destinations.
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Permalink Reply by Duppie on
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Oh shoot. Here we go again.
It's a great blog entry explaining your reasons why you run red lights. You take your own responsibility, you review the situation, etc. All good stuff, that I agree with (even though I don't run red lights).
You then ruin it again by stating that you want to change the law (presumably into treat a red-light as a stop-then-yield). I am still waiting on you (or anyone else) to show me some references that prove that this law will increase safety for bicyclists.
Just because it is unfair is no good reason to go and change the law. The general public probably thinks that outlawing cell-phone use while driving is unfair, given the large number of drivers that do not follow that law. Still, we wouldn't want to change the law to allow cell-phone use while driving
Chicago Bicycle Advocate said:DUG: Please see Heather Stratton's response. I wrote that post because I wish to advocate for a change in the law. Will my little post on my little blog have an impact? Almost certainly not, but change is a process. It has to start somewhere. Cyclists that run lights are often scoffed at as arrogant outlaws. That, in my view, is unfair. There are legitimate reasons for not following the rules of the road when biking in traffic.
notoriousDUG said:I think that is a little upsetting that you, as an attorney, failed to note or point out that regardless of your justification for running a traffic light or sign it is still illegal and punishable via citation and fine. Not to mention that if you choose to disobey a traffic control and end up in an accident, regardless of the other party's level of malice or stupidity, you are going to be viewed as in the wrong and probably have no recourse when it comes to getting compensated for the damages even if it could be argued the other person was at fault.
And for the record; I run lights and signs for the same reason you do but I recognize the legal position it puts me in and choose to not advertise or publicly justify my actions because I do not want to give people the impression they are in the right to do so.
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