Fixed gear?

Maybe because I'm 50, love technology, prefer to keep my intestines on this side of my abdominal wall OR all of the above, I just do not understand the love of "fixies". I mean what is so wrong with shifting gears. I just can't see myself enjoying my 25 mile RT commute without gears.

They certainly look cool but can someone please explain these brakeless beauties to me.

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Permalink Reply by Gecko on November 21, 2013 at 6:28am

There are fully geared road bikes out there that are lighter than your fixed gear, so the 'lighter weight' of a fixed gear is not an arguable point.  The friction from properly adjusted and lubricated derailleurs and pulleys is nearly zero, and again, not an arguable point.

Even when 'coasting' downhill on your fixed gear, your legs are moving, and if your legs are moving, your muscles are working.  They may not be working at 100%, but they are working more than your legs at rest while coasting, which is zero.  The work your legs are doing is still above zero at all times on a fixed gear.

The other bad thing about fixed gear is that if there is any sort of technical obstacle, you can't plant your feet at 3 and 9 o'clock (parallel) and have that 'platform' to stabilize your riding over said obstacle because the pedals are always forced to move.  This creates a dangerous situation because two legs are stronger than one, and if the leg you happen to be favoring while navigating said obstacle fails, you fall, just because you were riding a fixed gear and not a freewheel.  That and the pedal clearance over the obstacle is greatly reduced when your pedal is at 6 o'clock, possibly causing your pedal to hit the obstacle you intended to avoid and making you fall that way.  Exactly why you very, very rarely see fixed gear BMX or mountain bikes.



BruceBikes said:

The light weight is a byproduct of not needing shifters, deraillleurs, free-hubs, cassettes, extra chainrings, extra brake calipers, and extra brake levers.  The bike is otherwise the same as a normal road bike, but lighter.

Acceleration and top speed are indeed the byproduct of light weight, but also the byproduct of less rotational mass in the crank arms, less rotational mass in the rear well, and less friction from derailleurs and pulleys.  This again would not be possible unless it were a fixed gear.

From physics, work is the result of a force acting on a body.  When riding downhill on a fixed gear, I need to apply no force to the pedals, so I am doing no work.  A fixed gear is equally as efficient as a geared bike in this respect.

Nick G said:

Efficiency!  A bicycle is a machine, so efficiency is key to its operation.  It is your lightest bike, which automatically skews the efficiency in its favor.  Your acceleration and top speed are all a byproduct of the higher efficiency due to the light weight.  However, efficiency is the ratio of work output to work input, therefore because you have to work LESS on a freewheel bike OF THE SAME WEIGHT because you're able to take advantage of coasting down grades, the mechanical efficiency of a freewheel bike is HIGHER than a fixed gear.  Your work input is higher to reach the same work output.  It's simple physics.

Permalink Reply by S on November 21, 2013 at 6:32am

The weight difference and efficiency differences between a fixed gear bike and a geared bike is low enough that I would suspect that most people wouldn't notice it unless they were riding for very long distances or at very high speeds.  The differences in how a fixed gear bikes works from a bike with a freehub probably overwhelms anything else in terms of feeling when riding.

BruceBikes said:

The light weight is a byproduct of not needing shifters, deraillleurs, free-hubs, cassettes, extra chainrings, cables, cable housing, extra brake calipers, and extra brake levers.  The bike is otherwise the same as a normal road bike, but lighter.

Permalink Reply by BruceBikes on November 21, 2013 at 6:36am

Nick, I think we need to agree to disagree on this.

Keep the rubber side down and the wind at your back.



Nick G said:

There are fully geared road bikes out there that are lighter than your fixed gear, so the 'lighter weight' of a fixed gear is not an arguable point.  The friction from properly adjusted and lubricated derailleurs and pulleys is nearly zero, and again, not an arguable point.

Even when 'coasting' downhill on your fixed gear, your legs are moving, and if your legs are moving, your muscles are working.  They may not be working at 100%, but they are working more than your legs at rest while coasting, which is zero.  The work your legs are doing is still above zero on a fixed gear.

The other bad thing about fixed gear is that if there is any sort of technical obstacle, you can't plant your feet at 3 and 9 o'clock (parallel) and have that 'platform' to stabilize your riding over said obstacle because the pedals are always forced to move.  This creates a dangerous situation because two legs are stronger than one, and if the leg you happen to be favoring while navigating said obstacle fails, you fall, just because you were riding a fixed gear and not a freewheel.  Exactly why you very, very rarely see fixed gear BMX or mountain bikes. 

Permalink Reply by S on November 21, 2013 at 6:41am

Sequential gearboxes can be found in some road cars, if it's combined with paddle shifters and some computer control, it offers the best of both worlds.  You can let the computer handle the shifting for you when you're in traffic or don't care but can take over and shift up and down using the paddle shifters (no clutch pedal needed) when you want to.  

Nick G said:

Fixed gear is for racing on a track, sequential gearbox is for racing on a track.  Neither of these are effective or useful on a long-term basis for commuting unless you like showing off or punishing yourself for no good reason when there are better, more efficient solutions out there.

Permalink Reply by Skip Montanaro 0mi on November 21, 2013 at 6:48am

I'm new to this thread, only having discovered it in the past day or two. I recently built my first fixed gear bike, more-or-less as an experiment. A few years ago I rode a Schwinn Madison until it was stolen, but I only ever rode it with the single-speed freewheel side of the flip-flop hub.

I'm pushing 60, so I'm definitely not your stereotypical hipster fixie type. My bike isn't either. The frame is from a Trek 520 with Dia-Compe cantilever brakes (what came with that bike). It has drop bars, aero levers, some sort of wheelset with Roval hubs (maybe Alex rims?) I got off Ebay, Panaracer Pasela 700x32 tires and SKS Chromoplastic fenders. Unlike most people who ride fixed, I also ride it with Look KeO pedals.

I like the bike and the experience of riding fixed just fine. In fact, I plan to ride it on a 60-on-60 for my birthday Sunday. It serves well as a commuter here in Flatlandia. It's been an interesting experiment. Among other things:

  • I love the silence
  • I love the simplicity
  • I think it is making me a better rider (more attention to my pedal stroke, no possibility of downshifting for headwinds and uphills, or upshifting for tailwinds and downhills)

Despite having ridden Look pedals for probably 25 years, I am getting better at clipping into my pedals as well. There's nothing like a moving target to improve your aim! I also have a somewhat better appreciation for why fixed gear riders tend to stop less often at signs and lights (not that riding fixed is a justification for misbehavior). Like the OP, I have a 25+ mile round trip commute. I don't see fixed gear as a big impediment there. I will at some point put a single-speed freewheel on it and see how that changes things.

Will I ever dispense completely with gears? Nope. I like all my vintage steel derailleur-and-tubular-equipped bikes as well. In fact, I'm in the midst of building up yet another one ('79 Redcay).

Permalink Reply by Gelacio on November 21, 2013 at 7:12am

wow this conversation takes me back to 2004 :)

 

Permalink Reply by Jacob Taylor on November 21, 2013 at 8:00am

Totally agree with you, buddy. These are the most important aspects which I found in my fixed gear bike and it has bound me to fall in love with it. I love my bike.

BruceBikes said:

In my experience, my fixed gear is the most efficient of all my bikes.  It is the lightest and has the most direct and efficient transmission of power.  I find it accelerates better, requires less energy to maintain speed and generally cruises easier at a higher speed.

Also, just because the pedals are spinning doesn't mean you're using energy.  You still "coast" on a fixed gear - you stop applying power and just sort of let your legs spin around with the pedals.

Nick G said:

My whole disagreement with fixed gear is this:  Why waste energy?  You save energy when coasting so you can use it again when you need to pedal.  That's why coasting bikes are so popular!  With fixed gear, you have to work harder ALL THE TIME, which doesn't make any sense. 

Permalink Reply by MK on November 21, 2013 at 8:28am

Properly Adjusted and Lubricated = More maintenance for gears than fixed, an arguable point.

Never have I come into an obstacle where I missed having the ability to 'stabilize' my riding. I think riding fixed helps you balance everything, including leg strength. If there's a big obstacle, I just brake. 

Ultimately though, different strokes for different folks. It's fine if you hate fixed riding (and think it's only place is a velodrome) but that doesn't mean everyone else should think the same.


Nick G said:

There are fully geared road bikes out there that are lighter than your fixed gear, so the 'lighter weight' of a fixed gear is not an arguable point.  The friction from properly adjusted and lubricated derailleurs and pulleys is nearly zero, and again, not an arguable point.

Even when 'coasting' downhill on your fixed gear, your legs are moving, and if your legs are moving, your muscles are working.  They may not be working at 100%, but they are working more than your legs at rest while coasting, which is zero.  The work your legs are doing is still above zero at all times on a fixed gear.

The other bad thing about fixed gear is that if there is any sort of technical obstacle, you can't plant your feet at 3 and 9 o'clock (parallel) and have that 'platform' to stabilize your riding over said obstacle because the pedals are always forced to move.  This creates a dangerous situation because two legs are stronger than one, and if the leg you happen to be favoring while navigating said obstacle fails, you fall, just because you were riding a fixed gear and not a freewheel.  That and the pedal clearance over the obstacle is greatly reduced when your pedal is at 6 o'clock, possibly causing your pedal to hit the obstacle you intended to avoid and making you fall that way.  Exactly why you very, very rarely see fixed gear BMX or mountain bikes.



BruceBikes said:

The light weight is a byproduct of not needing shifters, deraillleurs, free-hubs, cassettes, extra chainrings, extra brake calipers, and extra brake levers.  The bike is otherwise the same as a normal road bike, but lighter.

Acceleration and top speed are indeed the byproduct of light weight, but also the byproduct of less rotational mass in the crank arms, less rotational mass in the rear well, and less friction from derailleurs and pulleys.  This again would not be possible unless it were a fixed gear.

From physics, work is the result of a force acting on a body.  When riding downhill on a fixed gear, I need to apply no force to the pedals, so I am doing no work.  A fixed gear is equally as efficient as a geared bike in this respect.

Nick G said:

Efficiency!  A bicycle is a machine, so efficiency is key to its operation.  It is your lightest bike, which automatically skews the efficiency in its favor.  Your acceleration and top speed are all a byproduct of the higher efficiency due to the light weight.  However, efficiency is the ratio of work output to work input, therefore because you have to work LESS on a freewheel bike OF THE SAME WEIGHT because you're able to take advantage of coasting down grades, the mechanical efficiency of a freewheel bike is HIGHER than a fixed gear.  Your work input is higher to reach the same work output.  It's simple physics.

Permalink Reply by Gecko on November 21, 2013 at 8:30am

The lack of logic, reason, and even a cursory understanding of elementary physics here is astounding.

You people are just like fundamental religious nuts.  Even when presented with clear scientific evidence, you continue to go on merrily proclaiming that your way is the best way.

"Agree to disagree" is a cop out.

Permalink Reply by BruceBikes on November 21, 2013 at 10:00am

Nick, I thought we had a fine debate.  Neither of us won, but that's how it goes sometimes.

...

If it makes you feel any better, I changed my mind.  Fixed gears are TOTALLY inefficient, and they should NEVER be ridden anywhere but a velodrome.

Physics!



Nick G said:

The lack of logic, reason, and even a cursory understanding of elementary physics here is astounding.

You people are just like fundamental religious nuts.  Even when presented with clear scientific evidence, you continue to go on merrily proclaiming that your way is the best way.

"Agree to disagree" is a cop out.

Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on November 21, 2013 at 10:10am

There is a lack of understanding but mostly on your end of it...

First off how much fixed gear riding have you actually done?

If you are riding a reasonable ratio on a bike with brakes the effort it takes to get anywhere is the same, if not less, than it is on a single speed bike.  While it is true your legs still have to move around you do not have to expend much effort to do that and, if you have brakes, there is no added work breaking either.

In the winter it also provides you with more control.

Side note, I don't think I have ever heard of anyone running a 47-16 on the track.

Nick G said:

The lack of logic, reason, and even a cursory understanding of elementary physics here is astounding.

You people are just like fundamental religious nuts.  Even when presented with clear scientific evidence, you continue to go on merrily proclaiming that your way is the best way.

"Agree to disagree" is a cop out.

Permalink Reply by Kevin Mulcky on November 21, 2013 at 10:50am

One thing that I have noticed with the majority of casual bike riders who use bike-boom era 10 speed bikes, is that they never seem to shift! In fact, they always seem to be riding in cross-chained gearing. Who knows why?... For these types of casual users a fixed gear (or single speed) seems ideal. Much of the old bike boom era components were made of steel, including the wheels, which can be quite heavy and provide lousy results. 

For these causal riders, rebuilding an old schwinn into a fixed gear with some modern wheels is a great project. They can learn about bikes while not being overwhelmed with complicated (and expensive) gears, cassettes, dropout spacing, etc. The bike becomes more simple, more lightweight, faster, and easier and cheaper to maintain than their old bike. 

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