The Chainlink

Hello All,

I will have to be looking for a new rig at the end of last year I bought a very nice Litespeed siena. Its a compact frame when I took it out for the first time I came home after about a 2 hour ride and my hands were killing me to the point I couldent even grab and hold onto my water bottle. I went to my LBS and they told me a few things to try the same thing happened. So yesterday I grabed the bike and went to the shop they told me the frame was to big and yet too small I guess the reach is like 40cm too long but the seat post tube is like 2-2.5" too short. Now I trust the bike shop very much but I dont know what to do other than buying a new bike. Now I love this bike and I would do almost anything to try and keep it as I don't have enough money to buy a new bike. Please does anyone have any other ideas for me to try? And if not does any one know some one looking for a very nice litespeed?

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First thing i'd try is putting the seat level. The way it looks is that your weight is being shifted onto your hands by the nose-down position of the saddle. A higher bar position and shorter stem might help also.
That is a old pic I have sence then placed the seat in all positions moved the handlebar and tried a 70mm stem I even tried a bar with a flat top versus a round bar still same results.
How tall are you, what is the size of the bike? So we can look up geometry of the frame...Also can you post a level photo of the bike on flat ground?

-Ali
Here is a link for the geometry of the bike just the parts are not the same. It is a large or a size 57cm.
http://www.ruaneweb.net/bicycle/specifications.htm

There are a lot of shops that will do what is called a "fit to bike" where they will check your bike fit to you, address any of your comfort concerns. They will adjust the seat height/fore and aft, The handlebar height and if your willing they will have test stems for various lengths to help you get dialed in. Get a grip on Irving park does an excellent job, I think they charge close to 100 bucks and it takes about an hour.
Judging from the photo, you have long legs and a shorter upper body. As the seat is really high, and the stem is really short as well reversed for a rise. It looks like your seat is still not quite level, so you might be using your hands to stay on the seat which might be making your problem worse.

What I am about to suggest will go against the usual advice about bike fitting, but you might want to lower your seat a little...Judging from the photos your seat is a little too high which in turn is forcing you to lean too far down and forcing you to support a lot of your upper body with your hands...If you lower your seat a little that might put you in a little more upright position which inturn might enable your lower back to support most of your upper body hence alleviating some of the pressure off of your hands which I think might be the issue. Your pedal stroke will be a little less efficient but at least you will be more comfortable.

Also it is kinda hard to judge from the photos but I like my bars perfectly parallel to the ground which enables me to support my weight with my lower palm. Also wearing some padded cycling gloves will help a lot, also Fizik makes some bartape and gel combos that I have recently made a jump to. You wouldn't think that such a small amount of gel makes a big difference, but it have made a big difference in comfort for me.

I would be interested to hear how you spend most of your time on the bars as well...Whether you are on the tops, hoods, drops or ends...I personally spend most of the time either on the tops(closest part to the stem) or on my brake hoods. I will not go down to the drops unless I am really trying to get aerodynamic, or there is a horrendous headwind. I am rarely at the bar ends, other than while sprinting.

Also a shorter stem with a little more rise might help your case a lot by reducing the reach to the handlebars, and also raising your bars a little...

-Ali

Steve said:
Here is a link for the geometry of the bike just the parts are not the same. It is a large or a size 57cm.
http://www.ruaneweb.net/bicycle/specifications.htm

I don't know where you are, but I have a rideable "Fit Stem" http://tinyurl.com/2e7uxvc I would let you borrow. You would need to leave a deposit (fully refundable upon return). There are a lot of workarounds on bike fit... i.e. stem length, stem rise/fall, seatpost length, seatpost setback, different handlebars can drastically change your ride position, where you are positioned on the seat rails, HT extension risers, etc etc. If you are determined to stick with this frame and you are not utterly, drastically off base for size, you should be able to get something to work. In my experience, hand problems nearly always come from a too-high seatpost and too-low handlebar position. We're programmed to see the arrangement as attractive and correct due to bicycling's love affair with racing. Unfortunately, that is not how most of us ride and need our bike to fit. When you are racing, your legs are working along with your core to hold your body up by the strong downward force of your stroke. Your hands are very loose on the bars. When you're just pedaling through town, that force is not there, and you are left leaning on your palms, which is painful.

Also of note if the reach is too long, you might try some of the "randonneur" style drop bar designs. The tops flare back to allow you a more upright position when using them. Nitto makes a nice one as well as Modolo (through Velo Orange). I am set up to do personal fitting and have a number of bars you could look at to get an idea. If you want to look it over and even use the rideable fit-stem with your current set-up, that would be fine. No charge. I wouldn't want to lend out any bars without a fee, though. I'm in the western 'burbs.
hows about some photos of you on the bike? this way we can truely see how you connect with the bike.
by the way killer crank set!!!
I have already gone to my LBS Turin to have the bike fitted and they are the ones who told me they cant make the frame work for me. Like I said before I trust them totally they are a awesome shop with great workers. But do you think I should go back and ask them about handle bars? Also I was told that my shoulders were not level while I was sitting on the bike and my shoulders were facing out the sides. Would that be corrected by different bars?

Arrak Thumrs said:
I don't know where you are, but I have a rideable "Fit Stem" http://tinyurl.com/2e7uxvc I would let you borrow. You would need to leave a deposit (fully refundable upon return). There are a lot of workarounds on bike fit... i.e. stem length, stem rise/fall, seatpost length, seatpost setback, different handlebars can drastically change your ride position, where you are positioned on the seat rails, HT extension risers, etc etc. If you are determined to stick with this frame and you are not utterly, drastically off base for size, you should be able to get something to work. In my experience, hand problems nearly always come from a too-high seatpost and too-low handlebar position. We're programmed to see the arrangement as attractive and correct due to bicycling's love affair with racing. Unfortunately, that is not how most of us ride and need our bike to fit. When you are racing, your legs are working along with your core to hold your body up by the strong downward force of your stroke. Your hands are very loose on the bars. When you're just pedaling through town, that force is not there, and you are left leaning on your palms, which is painful.

Also of note if the reach is too long, you might try some of the "randonneur" style drop bar designs. The tops flare back to allow you a more upright position when using them. Nitto makes a nice one as well as Modolo (through Velo Orange). I am set up to do personal fitting and have a number of bars you could look at to get an idea. If you want to look it over and even use the rideable fit-stem with your current set-up, that would be fine. No charge. I wouldn't want to lend out any bars without a fee, though. I'm in the western 'burbs.
I was looking back over the numbers you provided above. Seatposts are reasonably common in very long lengths---driven a lot by mountain bike designs as well as the more recent popularity of compact road geometries such as yours. I would not be surprised if you could get an appropriately sized post, which would be about 65mm longer. 40 centimeters (~16") reach is another thing... are you sure that's right?! That is an extraordinary amount.

*Do you already feel stretched when on the tops? That is, not on the brake hoods or in the drops, but on the flat section nearer the stem clamp.
*What is the reach of your handlebars? http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_ra-e.html#reach Definition 2. Handlebar reach can easily vary by 40mm or more.

Remember too, as you raise the steerer height (with an extension) you bring the bars closer to you. Also remember that as you raise the saddle, the bars get farther from you. It is a bit of a balancing act.

As for your shoulder position, I think I would have to see it in person. Is that something you hadn't noticed before it was mentioned to you?

BTW, Wig is totally right. It is a bit of a theoretical exercise without being able to see your relation to the actual bike configuration.
Arrak Thumrs said:
Remember too, as you raise the steerer height (with an extension) you bring the bars closer to you.

To expand on this in a practical matter:

If you kept everything else the same and installed this 3.25"extension (http://tinyurl.com/2bz465z), you would reduce your reach by about an inch with that frame geometry.
Ok well I guess I'm not right on the reach. But when I am on the bars the top flat I am very stretched out. Now the reach of the bars are 90mm drop is 145mm. Great idea on the extender I would just have to change out my fork it is a full carbon steer.

Arrak Thumrs said:
I was looking back over the numbers you provided above. Seatposts are reasonably common in very long lengths---driven a lot by mountain bike designs as well as the more recent popularity of compact road geometries such as yours. I would not be surprised if you could get an appropriately sized post, which would be about 65mm longer. 40 centimeters (~16") reach is another thing... are you sure that's right?! That is an extraordinary amount.

*Do you already feel stretched when on the tops? That is, not on the brake hoods or in the drops, but on the flat section nearer the stem clamp.
*What is the reach of your handlebars? http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_ra-e.html#reach Definition 2. Handlebar reach can easily vary by 40mm or more.

Remember too, as you raise the steerer height (with an extension) you bring the bars closer to you. Also remember that as you raise the saddle, the bars get farther from you. It is a bit of a balancing act.

As for your shoulder position, I think I would have to see it in person. Is that something you hadn't noticed before it was mentioned to you?

BTW, Wig is totally right. It is a bit of a theoretical exercise without being able to see your relation to the actual bike configuration.

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