Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on April 6, 2010 at 9:21am

I'm not agreeing to anything.

Are you making things greener with the carbon footprint of all the stuff you have shipped?

The only thing I agree is that it is impossible to defeat people from spending their money somewhere it does not help the local community and screwing over local business by pretending to be a business.

You want to convert and build for the masses open a shop.

mfa cycle factory said:

lol

Most bike shops or guys that work in them started off as basement mechanics...as well as old school bike mechanics and builders....

I mean I don't get it.

excuse me for trying to make the world greener and building and converting cycles for the masses.

I can fix and repair anything I sell. If I can't fix or repair it,I don't sell it.

I think you're aiming missles at flys on this one: putting too much energy into something that is impossible to defeat.

First,you start riding,then you start wondering,then you start tinkering,then you start fixing,then start converting,and then you start building ....and that's when you open up a business....
Like I said, I'm not the avg consumer , and I love my LBS, but it does not start and end with them.....You do what is best for your situation.

We agree to disagree.

Nothing more is needed here.



notoriousDUG said:

First thing: You are what is one of the most annoying of all people out there when it comes to people who own shops or provide a legitimate service; you are the jerk who is running a pretend business out of your basement and taking money from the hands of people who have a legit business. Rather then spend money on insurance, making sure sales tax is paid, carrying insurance and doing all of the other stuff a bike ship has to do you are simply acting as a uninsured, taxless bike shop operating out of a no overhead location. Somebody gets hurt because of a bike you built or a part you sold what are you going to do? Are you prepared to fight the legal battle? Do you have to follow all the laws and carry all the costs a real bike shop does? Are you, as an individual, be held to the standard that a real shop is when a customer is dissatisfied?

People doing business like you do are the reason people who own shops tear their hair out because it's hard for them to charge enough to cover costs when they have to compete with somebody who doesn't have to play by the rules. You want to criticize the shops for their prices and practices because you can do it cheaper, try doing it RIGHT and cheaper and see where that gets you.

Second thing:

So when you save the 50 bucks on that wheel set what are you going to do if they come damaged and the seller tells you to pack sand? How about when you sell them to your 'patron' and they end up having a chronic issue with going out of true, are you going to stand behind them for your 'patron' out of your cost because chance are the e-bay guy isn't.

Third thing

your grocery store analogy is just ignorant. Store to store with a brick and mortar is shopping around; people do the same thing with bike parts. Now if it was buying them in the store vs. online then you would be apples to apples. The issue here is buying online vs. buying local, not shopping for the best price. When you shop local you are putting money back into your local economy and doing good for your community. When was the last time E-bay guy or Amazon did something for the local bike community? Last week I gave out prizes at a fund raiser donated by Ciclo Urbano, I have won prizes donated by Boulevard Bikes and other shops I can not think of off hand, Smart Bike Parts has put a beer in my hand more then once; do your e-bay savings do anything to help the community or promote cycling in yout city, because my purchases at the LBS sure as hell do. I shop, mostly, at Boulevard and Ciclo and every time I drop coin there the little extra I pay makes me happy because I know it is going to help the community, pay the salaries of those who help me all the time and generally make this area a better place to live.

Fourth thing:
You want to justify the way you do things by calling them good business then you need to actually be a business, not just some guy faking it out of his basement.

mfa cycle factory said:

Exploit in the sense that they take advantage of that opportunity,because that's
what is, a good opportunity to do business.period.

What do bikeshops do?

They purchase wholesale from places like qbp and sell at a highe price. Now,I don't have any qualms with that.It's business (key word).However, you mean to tell me I can't do the same? I can't search for the best price?

gtfoh.

How many people go to their local grocery stores or produce places to buy their goods?...,.Most people are willing travel miles and miles to places like trader joes or Aldis to get the best deals...are they wrong?

no.it's business(key word).

As a basement mechanic,I've moved over to the other side. The same side that my lbs is own. I search for the best deals and prices...again,I'm not part of the consumer market or field.

Patron comes to me and says,"hey,I want you to convert bike using a 700c vuelta wheelset".Right then and there I have factor in cost. How can i can I get him the wheelset he wants without killing my piggy bank,because I'm building the patron a bike at a set cost?....I research...

first I call around by calling all the lbs in the city,because the quicker I get the wheelset,the better. all the shops I call want 150 for the wheelset, but they have to order it. I make note of that and move on. ....

I go on eBay and do a search. Some guy in
Jersey has the wheelset for 100.00 ,plus free shipping...sold!.....why?....business(key word)....that's why......Not only am I getting a good deal on the wheels,but I'm not being charged for shipping,and it's going to be delivered to my house in the same amount of time it would take the lbs to receive it...

Dollar and cents(sense)= good business(key word)

notoriousDUG said:

This is nothing but bullshit rationalization of your behavior... How can you tell me that as a basement builder who uses a ton of parts your decision to purchase online is not a massive blow to your local bike shop? While it is possible that you might never spend much on service with a shop compared to the average cyclist I would be willing to bet that your parts purchases in a year far exceed those of the average cyclist.

Of course when I consider the fact that you feel bike shops 'exploit' the customers who seek service from them I am pretty sure that any argument I have for supporting your local shop is going to fall upon deaf, and ignorant, ears.

Any of you who feel that bike shops are exploiting their customers sit down and figure out their monthly costs vs. their labor rate, mark up and cash flow numbers for the year and then come back and tell me if you feel exploited. As a person who owns a shop (non-bike related) I can not even start to tell you how offensive it is to have people who are obviously ignorant to the cost of doing business complain about pricing on stuff.

mfa cycle factory said:

I here what you are saying. However, I am not a regular consumer.I fit in the
basement mechanic category, and that category is not large in population,so it does not
have a huge effect on the revenue that lbs generate yearly.

Your avg consumers do not know anything about bikes,so they are going to be the ones pumping money and providing revenue for LBS,which is the way it is suppose to be. LBS exist for the purpose of providing services to people that don't know how to fix their bikes. That market will always be there for
LBS to exploit (just saying).

The more a person learns about building and working on bikes,the less visits that person will make to the lbs.....which is why some lbs like to keep people ignorant when it comes to bikes...

it's a catch 22

notoriousDUG said:

mfa cycle factory said:
online:75 percent
lbs:15 percent
craigslist:10 percent.


No crying when local bike shops close then...

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on April 6, 2010 at 9:25am

Very yes.

I would be interested on info on your fab company; I have call for all kinds of work I sometimes sub out and always prefer it go to people I know and/or I know 'do the right thing.'

JKH said:

mfa cycle factory said:
Dollar and cents(sense)= good business(key word) Following this logic is why everything is out sourced to China, why meat packing plants have all moved to states that don't care about unsafe conditions for workers and why companies continue to pollute because the fines are cheaper than doing anything about it. Your business decisions have repercussions for your community and the world and ignoring that is morally irresponsible. I own my a small fabrication company and I face these decisions everyday. It effects my profit but I won't go to Home Depot, I buy hardware from a local firm and use lumber that is recycled or harvested sustainably by a farmer in SE Wisconson

mfa cycle factory said:
Your avg consumers do not know anything about bikes.

Lbs are a resource for all cyclists, not just the ignorant. I've been building bikes and wheelsets for twenty some years and I still appreciate the help I get occasionally. Even full time mechanics benefit for one anothers knowledge. At good shops professionals have access to training most of us don't. Sram classes on rebuilding suspension forks, Serotta fit certification or an old timer showing them how to rebuild a Campy shifter. I love my fixed gear but the cycling world is a lot bigger than fixed conversions. If we let the bike shops wither we'll have a cycling monoculture of only superficial bicycle knowledge.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on April 6, 2010 at 9:56am

You're not making sense... you already said you are against buying from the LBS based on the percentages that you posted! You have made it clear in your own words that you shop by price and not by level of service.

Let me ask you this, and please answer this one for me: That LBS, the one that is a great place to learn from and be a part of, how do you expect it to stay open to be all of that if you do not support it financially?

Even if the repairs of those less knowledgeable then you alone can support it without your purchases is it really right for you to enjoy the community and knowledge that others are paying to support?

Where did Sheldon Brown work? What supported him and let him enjoy life and learn enough to provide you with that info?

A LOCAL BIKE SHOP!!!

I am pretty sure he wanted people to rely less on their LBS for repairs but to still make purchases from them. In fact, I am not 100% sure but I swear it was on Mr. Browns site that I saw the quote that you should make a purchase every time you are in your LBS, especially if you asked a question. It was either there or Rivendell...


mfa cycle factory said:

I'm not arguing against that,but it is not limited to that.LBS is a great place to learn from and be a part of,the good ones that is.

I don't depend on any single source completely...If I can't get it online, I can get it from my LBS,and vice versa...

Two books and an online site taught me everything I know:
The Bicycle Manual by Eugene Sloan,The Bicycle Wheel by Jobst Brandt, and mister
Sheldon Brown.....I live and die by their words and practices,and they chanted the same things that I'm chanting .,,,Learn how to do things yourself and not be so dependent on your LBS..

options

options

options

research

research

research

never settle for less,settle for best.....


JKH said:

mfa cycle factory said: Dollar and cents(sense)= good business(key word)
Following this logic is why everything is out sourced to China, why meat packing plants have all moved to states that don't care about unsafe conditions for workers and why companies continue to pollute because the fines are cheaper than doing anything about it. Your business decisions have repercussions for your community and the world and ignoring that is morally irresponsible. I own my a small fabrication company and I face these decisions everyday. It effects my profit but I won't go to Home Depot, I buy hardware from a local firm and use lumber that is recycled or harvested sustainably by a farmer in SE Wisconson

mfa cycle factory said:
Your avg consumers do not know anything about bikes.

Lbs are a resource for all cyclists, not just the ignorant. I've been building bikes and wheelsets for twenty some years and I still appreciate the help I get occasionally. Even full time mechanics benefit for one anothers knowledge. At good shops professionals have access to training most of us don't. Sram classes on rebuilding suspension forks, Serotta fit certification or an old timer showing them how to rebuild a Campy shifter. I love my fixed gear but the cycling world is a lot bigger than fixed conversions. If we let the bike shops wither we'll have a cycling monoculture of only superficial bicycle knowledge.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by mfa cycle factory on April 6, 2010 at 10:18am

which is why Sheldon Brown was a great man....Regardless of the fact that he owned a shop or was a mechanic, he taught and provided information so that people wouldn't have to depend on bike shops all the time.

He would even provide information on how to make homemade tools to do the job of tools that are sold in bike shops..

cmon, you just provided me with ammo.


There is no right or wrong way here. I'm not against LBS and not limited to them either.

I stand independent as a free thinker and conceptualist,and I want all to grow and benefit...I would never limit someone to my services and I wouldn't want to be limited to someone's services.

I only work on and convert cycles to single speeds or fixies. However, for people that want other kinds of cycles, I send them to the LBS.



notoriousDUG said:

You're not making sense... you already said you are against buying from the LBS based on the percentages that you posted! You have made it clear in your own words that you shop by price and not by level of service. Let me ask you this, and please answer this one for me: That LBS, the one that is a great place to learn from and be a part of, how do you expect it to stay open to be all of that if you do not support it financially? Even if the repairs of those less knowledgeable then you alone can support it without your purchases is it really right for you to enjoy the community and knowledge that others are paying to support?

Where did Sheldon Brown work? What supported him and let him enjoy life and learn enough to provide you with that info?

A LOCAL BIKE SHOP!!!

I am pretty sure he wanted people to rely less on their LBS for repairs but to still make purchases from them. In fact, I am not 100% sure but I swear it was on Mr. Browns site that I saw the quote that you should make a purchase every time you are in your LBS, especially if you asked a question. It was either there or Rivendell...


mfa cycle factory said:

I'm not arguing against that,but it is not limited to that.LBS is a great place to learn from and be a part of,the good ones that is.

I don't depend on any single source completely...If I can't get it online, I can get it from my LBS,and vice versa... Two books and an online site taught me everything I know: The Bicycle Manual by Eugene Sloan,The Bicycle Wheel by Jobst Brandt, and mister
Sheldon Brown.....I live and die by their words and practices,and they chanted the same things that I'm chanting .,,,Learn how to do things yourself and not be so dependent on your LBS..

options

options

options

research

research

research

never settle for less,settle for best.....


JKH said:

mfa cycle factory said: Dollar and cents(sense)= good business(key word)
Following this logic is why everything is out sourced to China, why meat packing plants have all moved to states that don't care about unsafe conditions for workers and why companies continue to pollute because the fines are cheaper than doing anything about it. Your business decisions have repercussions for your community and the world and ignoring that is morally irresponsible. I own my a small fabrication company and I face these decisions everyday. It effects my profit but I won't go to Home Depot, I buy hardware from a local firm and use lumber that is recycled or harvested sustainably by a farmer in SE Wisconson mfa cycle factory said: Your avg consumers do not know anything about bikes.

Lbs are a resource for all cyclists, not just the ignorant. I've been building bikes and wheelsets for twenty some years and I still appreciate the help I get occasionally. Even full time mechanics benefit for one anothers knowledge. At good shops professionals have access to training most of us don't. Sram classes on rebuilding suspension forks, Serotta fit certification or an old timer showing them how to rebuild a Campy shifter. I love my fixed gear but the cycling world is a lot bigger than fixed conversions. If we let the bike shops wither we'll have a cycling monoculture of only superficial bicycle knowledge.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on April 6, 2010 at 10:31am

I notice you choose to ignore the question I asked you to answer...

He gave people the skills to not depend on shops and showed them how to make tools not so they could abandon the LBS that helped them out when they where newbies but in order to help open their horizons and turn them from a service customer into a parts customer.

There is a difference between not being dependent on something and abandoning it.

I only gave you ammo if you are so stuck on your point that you can find proof of it in everything you read.

There may not be a right and a wrong but there is a locally and socially conscious and a locally and socially ignorant.

If you are not against the LBS then why are you only making 15% of your purchases there?

no one is limiting you. My point is that if you are not going to patronize the LBS with most of your purchases then you should not stop in to reap the benefits of the LBS. You don't buy most of your stuff there then stop asking questions, accepting freebies, test riding bikes, hanging out or otherwise enjoying the benefits to the consumer and community the LBS provides.

You only do conversions? What, real bike repair is to hard for you? You're a 'cycle factory' but you can't install a derailleur or build a multi-speed bike?

mfa cycle factory said:

which is why Sheldon Brown was a great man....Regardless of the fact that he owned a shop or was a mechanic, he taught and provided information so that people wouldn't have to depend on bike shop all the time.
He would even provide information on how to make homemade tools to do the job of tools that are sold in bike shops..
cmon, you just provided me with ammo.


There is no right or wrong way here. I'm not against LBS and not limited to them either.

I stand independent as a free thinker and conceptualist,and I want all to grow and benefit...I would never limit someone to my services and I wouldn't want to be limited to someone's services.

I only work on and convert cycles to single speeds or fixies. However, for people that want other kinds of cycles, I send them to the LBS.



notoriousDUG said:

You're not making sense... you already said you are against buying from the LBS based on the percentages that you posted! You have made it clear in your own words that you shop by price and not by level of service. Let me ask you this, and please answer this one for me: That LBS, the one that is a great place to learn from and be a part of, how do you expect it to stay open to be all of that if you do not support it financially? Even if the repairs of those less knowledgeable then you alone can support it without your purchases is it really right for you to enjoy the community and knowledge that others are paying to support?

Where did Sheldon Brown work? What supported him and let him enjoy life and learn enough to provide you with that info?

A LOCAL BIKE SHOP!!!

I am pretty sure he wanted people to rely less on their LBS for repairs but to still make purchases from them. In fact, I am not 100% sure but I swear it was on Mr. Browns site that I saw the quote that you should make a purchase every time you are in your LBS, especially if you asked a question. It was either there or Rivendell...


mfa cycle factory said:

I'm not arguing against that,but it is not limited to that.LBS is a great place to learn from and be a part of,the good ones that is.

I don't depend on any single source completely...If I can't get it online, I can get it from my LBS,and vice versa...
Two books and an online site taught me everything I know: The Bicycle Manual by Eugene Sloan,The Bicycle Wheel by Jobst Brandt, and mister
Sheldon Brown.....I live and die by their words and practices,and they chanted the same things that I'm chanting .,,,Learn how to do things yourself and not be so dependent on your LBS..

options

options

options

research

research

research

never settle for less,settle for best.....


JKH said:

mfa cycle factory said: Dollar and cents(sense)= good business(key word)
Following this logic is why everything is out sourced to China, why meat packing plants have all moved to states that don't care about unsafe conditions for workers and why companies continue to pollute because the fines are cheaper than doing anything about it. Your business decisions have repercussions for your community and the world and ignoring that is morally irresponsible. I own my a small fabrication company and I face these decisions everyday. It effects my profit but I won't go to Home Depot, I buy hardware from a local firm and use lumber that is recycled or harvested sustainably by a farmer in SE Wisconson
mfa cycle factory said: Your avg consumers do not know anything about bikes.

Lbs are a resource for all cyclists, not just the ignorant. I've been building bikes and wheelsets for twenty some years and I still appreciate the help I get occasionally. Even full time mechanics benefit for one anothers knowledge. At good shops professionals have access to training most of us don't. Sram classes on rebuilding suspension forks, Serotta fit certification or an old timer showing them how to rebuild a Campy shifter. I love my fixed gear but the cycling world is a lot bigger than fixed conversions. If we let the bike shops wither we'll have a cycling monoculture of only superficial bicycle knowledge.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by mfa cycle factory on April 6, 2010 at 11:01am

You really do make laugh.

but that's a good thing.


I like your stride and your motivation,but your
statements walk crookedly.

online bike shops don't count?

lol

cmon

in all actuality, I pump more money universally
, then I do locally. Most of my purchases go to
yellow jersey, abaxo and wheels and sprockets....

Most of my local purchases go to Rapid Transit Bike Shop,
Smart Bike Parts,Yojimbos and A nearly new....mainly a nearly new
because I like revamping old parts.

Most LBS,except for Yojimbos(but his hours are weird),don't have the latest
stuff,so they have to order it .Problem number 1.

Problem number 2:huge difference in prices ,like almost 50 percent.

Problem 3 : A lot of LBS don't sell classic NOS,you can really only get that
online or at a bike swop.

Those are the reasons why most of my purchases will take place online....However, I will never
completely abandoned a LBS.I by stuff from a LBS once a week,like tubes
bar ribbon and pedals

I'm sure there are other basement mechanics that have similar purchasing models....

I am providing revenue locally and globally....which makes me a pretty dynamic investor.

I'm feeding bike culture as a planet, not just as a city.

again, to each his own.




notoriousDUG said:

I notice you choose to ignore the question I asked you to answer...

He gave people the skills to not depend on shops and showed them how to make tools not so they could abandon the LBS that helped them out when they where newbies but in order to help open their horizons and turn them from a service customer into a parts customer.

There is a difference between not being dependent on something and abandoning it.

I only gave you ammo if you are so stuck on your point that you can find proof of it in everything you read.

There may not be a right and a wrong but there is a locally and socially conscious and a locally and socially ignorant.

If you are not against the LBS then why are you only making 15% of your purchases there?

no one is limiting you. My point is that if you are not going to patronize the LBS with most of your purchases then you should not stop in to reap the benefits of the LBS. You don't buy most of your stuff there then stop asking questions, accepting freebies, test riding bikes, hanging out or otherwise enjoying the benefits to the consumer and community the LBS provides.

You only do conversions? What, real bike repair is to hard for you? You're a 'cycle factory' but you can't install a derailleur or build a multi-speed bike?

mfa cycle factory said:

which is why Sheldon Brown was a great man....Regardless of the fact that he owned a shop or was a mechanic, he taught and provided information so that people wouldn't have to depend on bike shop all the time.
He would even provide information on how to make homemade tools to do the job of tools that are sold in bike shops..
cmon, you just provided me with ammo.


There is no right or wrong way here. I'm not against LBS and not limited to them either.

I stand independent as a free thinker and conceptualist,and I want all to grow and benefit...I would never limit someone to my services and I wouldn't want to be limited to someone's services.

I only work on and convert cycles to single speeds or fixies. However, for people that want other kinds of cycles, I send them to the LBS.



notoriousDUG said:

You're not making sense... you already said you are against buying from the LBS based on the percentages that you posted! You have made it clear in your own words that you shop by price and not by level of service. Let me ask you this, and please answer this one for me: That LBS, the one that is a great place to learn from and be a part of, how do you expect it to stay open to be all of that if you do not support it financially? Even if the repairs of those less knowledgeable then you alone can support it without your purchases is it really right for you to enjoy the community and knowledge that others are paying to support?

Where did Sheldon Brown work? What supported him and let him enjoy life and learn enough to provide you with that info?

A LOCAL BIKE SHOP!!!

I am pretty sure he wanted people to rely less on their LBS for repairs but to still make purchases from them. In fact, I am not 100% sure but I swear it was on Mr. Browns site that I saw the quote that you should make a purchase every time you are in your LBS, especially if you asked a question. It was either there or Rivendell...


mfa cycle factory said:

I'm not arguing against that,but it is not limited to that.LBS is a great place to learn from and be a part of,the good ones that is.

I don't depend on any single source completely...If I can't get it online, I can get it from my LBS,and vice versa...
Two books and an online site taught me everything I know: The Bicycle Manual by Eugene Sloan,The Bicycle Wheel by Jobst Brandt, and mister
Sheldon Brown.....I live and die by their words and practices,and they chanted the same things that I'm chanting .,,,Learn how to do things yourself and not be so dependent on your LBS..

options

options

options

research

research

research

never settle for less,settle for best.....


JKH said:

mfa cycle factory said: Dollar and cents(sense)= good business(key word)
Following this logic is why everything is out sourced to China, why meat packing plants have all moved to states that don't care about unsafe conditions for workers and why companies continue to pollute because the fines are cheaper than doing anything about it. Your business decisions have repercussions for your community and the world and ignoring that is morally irresponsible. I own my a small fabrication company and I face these decisions everyday. It effects my profit but I won't go to Home Depot, I buy hardware from a local firm and use lumber that is recycled or harvested sustainably by a farmer in SE Wisconson
mfa cycle factory said: Your avg consumers do not know anything about bikes.

Lbs are a resource for all cyclists, not just the ignorant. I've been building bikes and wheelsets for twenty some years and I still appreciate the help I get occasionally. Even full time mechanics benefit for one anothers knowledge. At good shops professionals have access to training most of us don't. Sram classes on rebuilding suspension forks, Serotta fit certification or an old timer showing them how to rebuild a Campy shifter. I love my fixed gear but the cycling world is a lot bigger than fixed conversions. If we let the bike shops wither we'll have a cycling monoculture of only superficial bicycle knowledge.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by J on April 6, 2010 at 11:19am

ReNae, as others have pointed out:

1) If it's convenient, community toolkits are ideal for your more serious projects. Besides places like West Town, many bicycle clubs have one or two shared kits -- which is just one more good reason to join one.

2) As others have stated, many shops sell their shop tools once or twice a year (I do it twice per year at mine) at a fraction of the retail price. This is a great way to pick up some of the more expensive, bike-specific tools such as 4th hand tools, chain breakers, and the like. As a bonus, they will usually be the higher grade industry (rather than consumer) versions.

3) Don't rule out a very high quality multi tool. These have dramatically improved over the years, and you'd be surprised how much utility you can get out of a tiny chunk of articulated metal. Some of the best inexpensive chain tools these days are actually embedded into multi tools. It's an important part of the arsenal.

4) For everything else -- remember that you really don't need to buy bike-specific brands. Wrenches, screwdrivers, allen keys, hacksaws, files, and cable cutters can be found at various price and quality levels at your friendly neighborhood hardware store (or, if you budget is very tight, dollar store).

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by ReNae on April 6, 2010 at 4:21pm

To everyone, including the 2 who hijacked this thread, thanks for your input.

First, believe me, I understand the issues regarding the stand alone LBS vs. online. I worked retail for far too long, was in management when our competitors started big box selling and undercutting our prices. All we could do was offer good customer service. So we'd get the people who'd come in with questions, get our answers and then go to our competitor who was 2 dollars cheaper. I understand why the LBS might have higher prices. But to that end, I haven't had the best customer service experiences at the LBS that I've been to.

Second, my issue with the LBS that I've been to is that overall, they've been intimidating and/or they've never had the part I need when I want it. And that's after calling around a few places. It's like I'm dealing with the mechanic when I had a car as far as getting knowledge as to the best way to maintain/fix stuff. A few of the shops I've been to have very little in the way of tools. And as much as I'd like to get the really nice tools, I can't. But neither do I want the tools that are so cheap they're not going to last. So I am kinda looking for a good bike shop that tends to have a good overall selection so as to offer a variety of prices.

I've got a nice Bell multi tool as well as my own small general tool kits. I think I am pretty set on allen wrenches hehe. I've noticed that there are some tools that probably make certain jobs much easier if you've got them - so although I could probably figure out a way to pop the pin on a chain, I'm sure it's much easier just to use the chain tool (or thingamajig in my modern parlance).

Thanks again.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by mfa cycle factory on April 6, 2010 at 5:06pm

Sounds good. Do what feels comfortable.

Mandatory tools to have in your collection:

Pedal wrench ( self explanatory)

Three way Allen wrench or hexagonal wrench ( 6mm,5mm,4mm) - You will need this to adjust your stem or remove it....you will also need it for seattube bolts that have allen heads, and a host of other things. Also, the tool provides better hand leverage than your basic allen wrench set. Park Tool also carries individual allen wrenches that come with handles.

12 inch adjustable wrench( very very mandatory)

Cotterless Crank Remover ( Preferably the Park Tool CCP-22)

Tire Levers ( get the ones with metal inserts ..the plastic ones break)

Gear Wrenches or open wrenches( 8mm - 19mm)..most outside( on the outside of the rear and front drops) locknuts are 15mm or 17mm ......Most seat tube bolt heads require a 14mm.

One thing to remember: when it comes to bike mechanics, it's all about leverage, and don't get frustrated when you can't un-seize or remove a part, and research everything. Look it up, ask questions, don't be afraid or let anyone intimidate you from getting knowledge that you are entitled to.

Check out the videos on this site:

http://bicycletutor.com









ReNae said:

To everyone, including the 2 who hijacked this thread, thanks for your input.

First, believe me, I understand the issues regarding the stand alone LBS vs. online. I worked retail for far too long, was in management when our competitors started big box selling and undercutting our prices. All we could do was offer good customer service. So we'd get the people who'd come in with questions, get our answers and then go to our competitor who was 2 dollars cheaper. I understand why the LBS might have higher prices. But to that end, I haven't had the best customer service experiences at the LBS that I've been to.

Second, my issue with the LBS that I've been to is that overall, they've been intimidating and/or they've never had the part I need when I want it. And that's after calling around a few places. It's like I'm dealing with the mechanic when I had a car as far as getting knowledge as to the best way to maintain/fix stuff. A few of the shops I've been to have very little in the way of tools. And as much as I'd like to get the really nice tools, I can't. But neither do I want the tools that are so cheap they're not going to last. So I am kinda looking for a good bike shop that tends to have a good overall selection so as to offer a variety of prices.

I've got a nice Bell multi tool as well as my own small general tool kits. I think I am pretty set on allen wrenches hehe. I've noticed that there are some tools that probably make certain jobs much easier if you've got them - so although I could probably figure out a way to pop the pin on a chain, I'm sure it's much easier just to use the chain tool (or thingamajig in my modern parlance).

Thanks again.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by spacemodular on April 7, 2010 at 3:14am

It is difficult to stock a wide selection of specialized tools for most shops. The tools that are sold are the ones that move quickly. That being said, you should be able to get a Park Chain tool at most local bike shops. Or perhaps a Pedro's, Topeak or Lifu/Icetoolz. All of these are moderately priced.

Special Orders for these types of tools usually shouldn't take much longer than buying off of the internet... And if it doesn't work out, some stores will let you return the tool for an exchange or refund. Ever ship something back that you didn't want?

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Spencer "Thunderball" Thayer! on April 7, 2010 at 3:43am

For the most part I think the argument between you two is innane and pointless but that's how all internet arguments are! Yay! But Dug let me question you on one of your quotes...

"You are...one of the most annoying of all people out there when it comes to people who own shops or provide a legitimate service; you are the jerk who is running a pretend business out of your basement and taking money from the hands of people who have a legit business."

What defines a legit business? Is it a license from the state? The employment of people? Cred in among other retailers? What?

Seems like you have a bit of elitism in ya. Don't get me wrong, I have sympathy for your stance. Supporting local business is becoming ever more important in this system of global capital. But it sounds like you want to deny up and coming business owners. You've mentioned how you are a self proclaimed believer in the capitalist system, so I am a little surprised that you would attack home business.

For much of my 20's I was self employed doing freelance web work. Should I have been concerned that I was taking away from other more established web design firms in the city? After all I was denying people their "legitimate services" by under cutting their high prices.

• ▶ Reply

Permalink Reply by Doug Haynes on April 7, 2010 at 3:53am

To be a business, in my opinion, you need to:

1. Be a registered corporation in good standing or sole proprietorship in the state where you are in business.
2. Have any licensees or permits required by your state or municipality for the line of work you are in.
3. Be properly covered by the insurance required for the type of business you do.
4. Charge and pay sales tax on the items you sell as well as file your taxes on the business each year.
5. If you employ people make sure they are properly insured and paid on the books.

Maybe I am an elitist about it but I tend to get annoyed when I have to compete for business with people who have no overhead because they are not a legitimate business. I am not out to get the little guy, I am the little guy.

Spencer "Thunderball" Thayer! said:

For the most part I think the argument between you two is innane and pointless but that's how all internet arguments are! Yay! But Dug let me question you on one of your quotes...
"You are what is one of the most annoying of all people out there when it comes to people who own shops or provide a legitimate service; you are the jerk who is running a pretend business out of your basement and taking money from the hands of people who have a legit business."

What defines a legit business? Is it a license from the state? The employment of people? Cred in among other retailers? What?

Seems like you have a bit of elitism in ya.

• ▶ Reply

• ‹ Previous
• 1
• 2
• 3
• 4
• Next ›
• Page