What does everyone do or say to 'bad' cyclists?? Anything? - The Chainlink2024-03-29T07:27:35Zhttps://thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?xg_source=activity&feed=yes&xn_auth=noThis thread reminds me of Bik…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-19:2211490:Comment:8304522014-06-19T01:07:07.715ZFar'arned Retrogrumpalunkus #63https://thechainlink.org/profile/JamesBlackHeron
<p>This thread reminds me of Bikeyface: <a href="http://theoldreader.com/feeds/51d22f2e8e49d024f70004f8" target="_blank">Unwanted Advice</a></p>
<p>This thread reminds me of Bikeyface: <a href="http://theoldreader.com/feeds/51d22f2e8e49d024f70004f8" target="_blank">Unwanted Advice</a></p> +1, bratty or not. Jody said…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-18:2211490:Comment:8300692014-06-18T16:39:57.928ZCharles_T_Duckhttps://thechainlink.org/profile/Charles_T_Duck
<p>+1, bratty or not.<br></br> <br></br> <cite>Jody said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say#2211490Comment87994"><div><div class="xg_user_generated">Sometimes, as silently passing cyclists nearly brush my left shoulder, I'll blurt out, '...on your RIGHT!'.<br></br> <br></br> Probably bratty of me, huh?<br></br> <br></br> <br></br> <cite>Barbra Mann said:…</cite></div>
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<p>+1, bratty or not.<br/> <br/> <cite>Jody said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say#2211490Comment87994"><div><div class="xg_user_generated">Sometimes, as silently passing cyclists nearly brush my left shoulder, I'll blurt out, '...on your RIGHT!'.<br/> <br/> Probably bratty of me, huh?<br/> <br/> <br/> <cite>Barbra Mann said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say#2211490Comment87991"><div>My greatest pet peeve...bicyclists passing a few inches from me with no word up...they are so antisocial or self-absorbed they cant make a sound??? A bell, an "on your left". I love telling people I appreciate their word for the FEW who do let me know they are gaining on me and about to pass. I wish people would be happier, too. A lot are oblivious...in their own world. People with scowls on their faces...shit in their ears...how can you be aware with music blasting in your ears or deep in thought about a scowl-inducing thought? Be in the moment for heaven's sake it will do wonders for your mind. Making eye contact is good. No more is even necessary in most situations but it can go a looong way. I also fear a bike hitting me as it flies through an intersection. Watch out because I watch out for you!!! In a good way!<br/> The hard thing...as a bike whizzes inches by me...there isn't even enough time to tell them they should've given an "on your left"...maybe WE should just say it for them..."on your left!" ya that's what I think I will do! Model it for them.</div>
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</blockquote> If someone puts my life at ri…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-18:2211490:Comment:8303032014-06-18T15:35:40.825ZJoe Schmoehttps://thechainlink.org/profile/JoeSchmoe
<p>If someone puts my life at risk, they get an earful. The same earful that cars get when they endanger peds. I usually won't yell at cars if I'm on a bike, and if they're in a position to be able to harm me, though I've chased down one or two for egregious behavior (U-turn that would have taken me out if I didn't act on a hunch that they were going to U-turn). For cyclists, the silent pass on the left as I'm stopped at a light that's about to turn green is the worst. Particularly when I'm…</p>
<p>If someone puts my life at risk, they get an earful. The same earful that cars get when they endanger peds. I usually won't yell at cars if I'm on a bike, and if they're in a position to be able to harm me, though I've chased down one or two for egregious behavior (U-turn that would have taken me out if I didn't act on a hunch that they were going to U-turn). For cyclists, the silent pass on the left as I'm stopped at a light that's about to turn green is the worst. Particularly when I'm going to pass them 20 seconds later. Second to blowing through a stop sign without slowing down or looking for cars, or other cyclists. Third being salmoning on busy streets (I could care less about side streets, really); for salmoners, I take the inside, even if it involves coming to a complete stop. And they get the stare of death. 4th being people who don't stay on their side of the path (riding 4 wide, etc.). </p> I gave up saying anything to…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-18:2211490:Comment:8302622014-06-18T14:56:16.402ZChitown_Mikehttps://thechainlink.org/profile/MikeRenkosiak
<p>I gave up saying anything to anyone else on a bike unless it directly involves my safety, then they get treated like a car. After being told that because someone commutes year round the laws don't apply to them, I'd rather there be more hood ornaments because people want to ride unsafely and take their well-being into their hands then get chewed out.</p>
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<p>I'll still stop and help someone who needs it, answer questions for people that have them, but beyond that I won't "police"…</p>
<p>I gave up saying anything to anyone else on a bike unless it directly involves my safety, then they get treated like a car. After being told that because someone commutes year round the laws don't apply to them, I'd rather there be more hood ornaments because people want to ride unsafely and take their well-being into their hands then get chewed out.</p>
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<p>I'll still stop and help someone who needs it, answer questions for people that have them, but beyond that I won't "police" other cyclists. They don't seem to care, I have seen cops that don't care, so therefore I shouldn't care.</p> +1 David Altenburg said:
Ple…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-13:2211490:Comment:8285212014-06-13T21:13:54.404ZGary Frederickshttps://thechainlink.org/profile/GaryFredericks
<p>+1<br></br> <br></br> <cite>David Altenburg said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?commentId=2211490%3AComment%3A828588&xg_source=msg_com_forum#2211490Comment828462"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Please stop. Their behavior is annoying, I get it. But we were all newbies once, and I for one, hope all those noobs trying out biking now keep at it and get more experienced - in which case, most will learn to ride straight and…</p>
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<p>+1<br/> <br/> <cite>David Altenburg said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?commentId=2211490%3AComment%3A828588&xg_source=msg_com_forum#2211490Comment828462"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Please stop. Their behavior is annoying, I get it. But we were all newbies once, and I for one, hope all those noobs trying out biking now keep at it and get more experienced - in which case, most will learn to ride straight and even buy their own all-important magic hat. Cycling in the city is scary for those not used to it - it really doesn't take much to scare off a lot of people.<br/> <br/> <cite>Roger said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A87927&page=5#2211490Comment828425"><div class="xg_user_generated"><p><span style="font-size: 13px;">it isn't the Divvy Bikers without helmets, in the middle of the trail, swerving and meandering at 4mph, though I moderately verbally abusive to them; </span></p>
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</blockquote> Please stop. Their behavior i…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-13:2211490:Comment:8284622014-06-13T21:06:40.395ZDavid Altenburghttps://thechainlink.org/profile/DavidAltenburg
<p>Please stop. Their behavior is annoying, I get it. But we were all newbies once, and I for one, hope all those noobs trying out biking now keep at it and get more experienced - in which case, most will learn to ride straight and even buy their own all-important magic hat. Cycling in the city is scary for those not used to it - it really doesn't take much to scare off a lot of people.<br></br> <br></br> <cite>Roger said:…</cite></p>
<p>Please stop. Their behavior is annoying, I get it. But we were all newbies once, and I for one, hope all those noobs trying out biking now keep at it and get more experienced - in which case, most will learn to ride straight and even buy their own all-important magic hat. Cycling in the city is scary for those not used to it - it really doesn't take much to scare off a lot of people.<br/> <br/> <cite>Roger said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A87927&page=5#2211490Comment828425"><div class="xg_user_generated"><p><span style="font-size: 13px;">it isn't the Divvy Bikers without helmets, in the middle of the trail, swerving and meandering at 4mph, though I moderately verbally abusive to them; </span></p>
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</blockquote> That intersection is the wors…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-13:2211490:Comment:8285882014-06-13T20:58:18.700ZDavid Altenburghttps://thechainlink.org/profile/DavidAltenburg
<p>That intersection is the worst. Especially because there's that bit of sunken asphalt around a manhole cover, so if you find yourself headed for that with cyclists on either side, you're screwed.</p>
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<p><cite>Michelle Milham said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?commentId=2211490%3AComment%3A828333#2211490Comment828385"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Yup! I had this happen to me yesterday, and there was one on…</p>
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<p>That intersection is the worst. Especially because there's that bit of sunken asphalt around a manhole cover, so if you find yourself headed for that with cyclists on either side, you're screwed.</p>
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<p><cite>Michelle Milham said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?commentId=2211490%3AComment%3A828333#2211490Comment828385"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Yup! I had this happen to me yesterday, and there was one on my left and one on my right at MKE and Division, neither of whom gave me any warning.They're lucky I didn't wobble, which is perfectly feasible ATM because it's now my third day clipless. And they were at full speed too. Scared the SHIT out of me. <br/> <br/> <cite>Simon Phearson said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?page=5&commentId=2211490%3AComment%3A828381&x=1#2211490Comment828021"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>I also get the type that passes just as the light is changing - so they're not running the red, but they're passing me just as I'm about to start up again. I'm also a fast commuter, so I'll often end up passing them.</p>
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</blockquote> Michelle, while you are of co…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-13:2211490:Comment:8285202014-06-13T20:51:11.322ZSimon Phearsonhttps://thechainlink.org/profile/SimonPhearson
<p>Michelle, while you are of course right that no particular demographic has "dibs" on the city's infrastructure, you'll note that Roger's complaints have virtually nothing to do with <em>who</em>'s riding, and entirely to do with <em>how</em>. There are good Divvyers, there are bad Divvyers. He's complaining about the bad ones. </p>
<p>Some people out there certainly are new - we're all "new" to cycling at some point. But why is that an excuse? You wouldn't forgive a teenaged new driver who…</p>
<p>Michelle, while you are of course right that no particular demographic has "dibs" on the city's infrastructure, you'll note that Roger's complaints have virtually nothing to do with <em>who</em>'s riding, and entirely to do with <em>how</em>. There are good Divvyers, there are bad Divvyers. He's complaining about the bad ones. </p>
<p>Some people out there certainly are new - we're all "new" to cycling at some point. But why is that an excuse? You wouldn't forgive a teenaged new driver who rolls over a cyclist because he's too busy texting, nor would you credit his claim that he just didn't see someone he should have seen, on this basis - would you? </p>
<p>Everyone who's biking on city streets or the LFP has a duty, first and foremost, to bike in a way that doesn't put others at risk. I don't care if they're new or not - if I go down because of their behavior, they're just as culpable, and I'm just as hurt. In some cases, there is really no excuse - salmoning should be obviously wrong with even a passing familiarity with traffic flow, for instance. Signaling should be a familiar habit for anyone who drives, too. Some of Roger's rules are more subtle and picked up on only with experience - ride to the right, pass to the left being one of those. But it shouldn't take a ton of experience to figure out you shouldn't be meandering slowly down the middle of the LPF, should it? Or to avoid riding four abreast? </p>
<p>Would you forgive the roadie riding through North Ave. Beach on a Saturday for plowing too quickly, just because he's new to cycling in Chicago?</p>
<p>I totally agree that we're not promoting ridership very well if we are openly hostile to everyone who doesn't follow every one of the rules we think they're supposed to follow. But we can find a good middle point between broad hostility and broad, uncritical acceptance. As it happens, <em>most</em> of the people who put me in danger on the streets or the LFP most days <em>aren't</em> new, and they <em>should</em> know better, just by thinking about their circumstances and observing those around them. That is how I learned to be a better and safer cyclist, myself. <br/> <br/> <cite>Michelle Stenzel said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?x=1&id=2211490%3ATopic%3A87927&page=6#2211490Comment828455"><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Roger, welcome to Chicago and I hope you continue to enjoy your experience here. However, I want to say that the "cycling culture" here may be different from that in Colorado. From your list of complaints, it sounds like you're more from a road bike/racing culture, which does exist here (Yay!), but there are many other types of people riding bikes in Chicago, and each one the right to be out there on the Lakefront Trail, in the bike lanes, and on the streets as much as you do. These include slow riders, casual riders, people hauling heavy loads, commuters, senior citizens, students, tourists, who are riding Divvy bikes, cruisers, hybrids, tandems, cargo bikes, fat-tire bikes and anything else you can think of. Yay for all of them! Some people find themselves riding the wrong way in a bike lane or on a sidewalk by mistake, or because they're not familiar with the area, or no safer choices are given them. Some people don't signal or "follow the rules" because they're new to all of this. Let's give them time and be happy they're out there with us.<br/> <br/> <cite><br/></cite></p>
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</blockquote> Roger, welcome to Chicago and…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-13:2211490:Comment:8284552014-06-13T20:16:59.475ZMichelle Shttps://thechainlink.org/profile/Michelle629
<p>Roger, welcome to Chicago and I hope you continue to enjoy your experience here. However, I want to say that the "cycling culture" here may be different from that in Colorado. From your list of complaints, it sounds like you're more from a road bike/racing culture, which does exist here (Yay!), but there are many other types of people riding bikes in Chicago, and each one the right to be out there on the Lakefront Trail, in the bike lanes, and on the streets as much as you do. These include…</p>
<p>Roger, welcome to Chicago and I hope you continue to enjoy your experience here. However, I want to say that the "cycling culture" here may be different from that in Colorado. From your list of complaints, it sounds like you're more from a road bike/racing culture, which does exist here (Yay!), but there are many other types of people riding bikes in Chicago, and each one the right to be out there on the Lakefront Trail, in the bike lanes, and on the streets as much as you do. These include slow riders, casual riders, people hauling heavy loads, commuters, senior citizens, students, tourists, who are riding Divvy bikes, cruisers, hybrids, tandems, cargo bikes, fat-tire bikes and anything else you can think of. Yay for all of them! Some people find themselves riding the wrong way in a bike lane or on a sidewalk by mistake, or because they're not familiar with the area, or no safer choices are given them. Some people don't signal or "follow the rules" because they're new to all of this. Let's give them time and be happy they're out there with us.<br/> <br/> <cite>Roger said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/what-does-everyone-do-or-say?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A87927&page=5#2211490Comment828425"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>A couple of points for Chicagoland Cyclists, from a Colorado Cyclist who just moved here. We (Chicagoland) have an amazing cycling culture. I spent over an hour talking bikes with a new shop I stopped in, and have met many cyclists on the LFT and elsewhere, exchanged kind words, numbers, and promises of riding together soon. I even joined a great group of cyclists to get out more.</p>
<p>However ...</p>
<p>I couldn't agree with Jody more here - <em>some</em> Chicagoland cyclists are giving <em>many</em> other cyclists a bad name. And it isn't the salmon riders in bike lanes, though I point them out; it isn't the Divvy Bikers without helmets, in the middle of the trail, swerving and meandering at 4mph, though I moderately verbally abusive to them; it isn't the LFT rider with no shirt/helmet/common sense/spatial awareness/bikehandling skill/both ears plugged into the latest dubstep track/no signaling wankers, though I make a special point to blow past them and yell left so loud, it interrupts beach volleyball play. </p>
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<p>IT IS ALL OF THIS.</p>
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<p>So pass along this info:</p>
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<p>Sidewalks are not for bicycles - you will only end up taking the pedestrian and yourself out.</p>
<p>Helmets for all cyclists - unless you want catastrophic injury.</p>
<p>Wrong way/One way is arrogance - unless your life's goal is to be a cab's hood ornament.</p>
<p>Pedal on the right and pass left - you do it in a car right (wait ... probably not).</p>
<p>Four abreast on the LFT is like wearing a sign that says moron - everyone who passes you thinks it, and most probably say it.</p>
<p>Signaling, especially if you ride up on someone, actually protects you! </p>
<p>If you get called out, you were probably doing something wrong - Your first response laden with expletives is most likely not the correct response. Try "sorry". </p>
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<p>And most of all, enjoy the bike culture you have created! Read Velonews, follow some pro teams on twitter, get out for a group ride regardless of your ability, share this lifestyle with your kids, and enjoy the lifestyle now that summer is upon us. </p>
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<p>Just let me know when you're turning left!</p>
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</blockquote> A couple of nights ago an ad…tag:thechainlink.org,2014-06-13:2211490:Comment:8285142014-06-13T20:01:26.697ZDavid Barishhttps://thechainlink.org/profile/DavidBarish
<p> A couple of nights ago an adult woman was riding on the sidewalk on a very dark street in Evanston. She did have lights. I passed her but was going to make a right turn. At the corner I stopped to wait for her fearing that I would right hook her. She stopped and we looked at each other before she hesitantly waived me on. I wanted to open the window and politely tell her that it would be safer to ride on the street as she would be more visible. i saw her because...well I am on this board.…</p>
<p> A couple of nights ago an adult woman was riding on the sidewalk on a very dark street in Evanston. She did have lights. I passed her but was going to make a right turn. At the corner I stopped to wait for her fearing that I would right hook her. She stopped and we looked at each other before she hesitantly waived me on. I wanted to open the window and politely tell her that it would be safer to ride on the street as she would be more visible. i saw her because...well I am on this board. Other drivers might not have seen her. My wife said, "She is not your problem. Just let her go and drive on." I did.</p>