Milwaukee v. Elston - The Chainlink2024-03-29T15:55:53Zhttps://thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?feed=yes&xn_auth=noElston has a lot of missed co…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-09:2211490:Comment:3021922011-03-09T07:38:43.461ZSteven Vancehttps://thechainlink.org/profile/stevevance
Elston has a lot of missed connections because of its run through industrial areas and the way it interacts with the river and highways. <br></br>
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<cite>Naomi Ruth Jackson said:</cite><br />
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A299205&page=4#2211490Comment300614"><div>I agree that Milwaukee in general feels safer, however I find that it simply connects to more places that I frequently commute to, like Logan Square, and Wicker…</div>
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Elston has a lot of missed connections because of its run through industrial areas and the way it interacts with the river and highways. <br/>
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<cite>Naomi Ruth Jackson said:</cite><br />
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A299205&page=4#2211490Comment300614"><div>I agree that Milwaukee in general feels safer, however I find that it simply connects to more places that I frequently commute to, like Logan Square, and Wicker Park</div>
</blockquote> I agree that Milwaukee in gen…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-06:2211490:Comment:3006142011-03-06T20:30:32.146ZNaomi Ruth Jacksonhttps://thechainlink.org/profile/NaomiRuthJackson
I agree that Milwaukee in general feels safer, however I find that it simply connects to more places that I frequently commute to, like Logan Square, and Wicker Park
I agree that Milwaukee in general feels safer, however I find that it simply connects to more places that I frequently commute to, like Logan Square, and Wicker Park Zoo. I like that. I should up…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-06:2211490:Comment:3005762011-03-06T06:24:33.246ZSteven Vancehttps://thechainlink.org/profile/stevevance
<p>Zoo. I like that. I should upload my pics (assuming I have them) of a sunny Saturday at the Elston Avenue Zoo. Then it becomes like an unregulated game reserve - a free-for-all.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesbondsv/5494762119/" title="Constant driveway traffic by Steven Vance, on Flickr"><img alt="Constant driveway traffic" height="180" src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5176/5494762119_15d4abc613_m.jpg" width="240"></img></a></p>
<p><br></br> <cite>notoriousDUG said:…</cite></p>
<p>Zoo. I like that. I should upload my pics (assuming I have them) of a sunny Saturday at the Elston Avenue Zoo. Then it becomes like an unregulated game reserve - a free-for-all.</p>
<p><a title="Constant driveway traffic by Steven Vance, on Flickr" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesbondsv/5494762119/"><img alt="Constant driveway traffic" height="180" width="240" src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5176/5494762119_15d4abc613_m.jpg"/></a></p>
<p><br/> <cite>notoriousDUG said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?x=1&id=2211490%3ATopic%3A299205&page=3#2211490Comment299407"><div><p>That is a great photo tour of why Elston is not that hot.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I usually don't use it because of the area around the Target being a zoo and the intersection at Ashland being a giant shit show of pissed off drivers.</p>
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</blockquote> I do the same but they often…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2997692011-03-04T19:38:03.879ZFar'arned Retrogrumpalunkus #63https://thechainlink.org/profile/JamesBlackHeron
<p>I do the same but they often get really "climby up my butty" while revving and acting all aggressive. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>These are the guys who will ride the bike lane aggressively until they can merge back in if they lose their drag race with the car in the proper lane. I even dislike it when I'm up ahead and these guys come flying up behind you and are upset that they can't continue to ride the bike lane while they try and win the pole position. <br></br> <br></br> <cite>Davo…</cite></p>
<p>I do the same but they often get really "climby up my butty" while revving and acting all aggressive. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>These are the guys who will ride the bike lane aggressively until they can merge back in if they lose their drag race with the car in the proper lane. I even dislike it when I'm up ahead and these guys come flying up behind you and are upset that they can't continue to ride the bike lane while they try and win the pole position. <br/> <br/>
<cite>Davo said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A299205&page=4#2211490Comment299747"><div><p>If I'm infront of a person in a right turn only lane and they don't have on a turn signal, I make sure that I take up the whole lane. When the light turns green, I take my sweet time getting up to speed just so that guy has to wait.</p>
<p> </p>
<blockquote><p>A lot of Chicago drivers think it is perfectly OK to ram right down the "turning lane" just before an intersection and get by 3-5 cars as they approach a red light, and then as soon as the light changes slam the accelerator down and race forward to get in front of the cars to their left and go straight rather than turning. This is very dangerous to bikes in the bike lane waiting to legally cross the intersection that get caught up in this drag-racing type activity. This is one more reason I endorse the Idaho stop so we can get out there before the Indy 500 starts when the light does turn green. </p>
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</blockquote> If I'm infront of a person in…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2997472011-03-04T17:38:28.853ZDavohttps://thechainlink.org/profile/DaveMicek
<p>If I'm infront of a person in a right turn only lane and they don't have on a turn signal, I make sure that I take up the whole lane. When the light turns green, I take my sweet time getting up to speed just so that guy has to wait.</p>
<p> </p>
<blockquote><p>A lot of Chicago drivers think it is perfectly OK to ram right down the "turning lane" just before an intersection and get by 3-5 cars as they approach a red light, and then as soon as the light changes slam the accelerator down and…</p>
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<p>If I'm infront of a person in a right turn only lane and they don't have on a turn signal, I make sure that I take up the whole lane. When the light turns green, I take my sweet time getting up to speed just so that guy has to wait.</p>
<p> </p>
<blockquote><p>A lot of Chicago drivers think it is perfectly OK to ram right down the "turning lane" just before an intersection and get by 3-5 cars as they approach a red light, and then as soon as the light changes slam the accelerator down and race forward to get in front of the cars to their left and go straight rather than turning. This is very dangerous to bikes in the bike lane waiting to legally cross the intersection that get caught up in this drag-racing type activity. This is one more reason I endorse the Idaho stop so we can get out there before the Indy 500 starts when the light does turn green. </p>
</blockquote> I agree that Milwaukee's narr…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2997462011-03-04T17:27:41.132ZFar'arned Retrogrumpalunkus #63https://thechainlink.org/profile/JamesBlackHeron
<p>I agree that Milwaukee's narrowness almost seems to act as a traffic-calming device, especially when bikes are present. Auto drivers are less-likely to try and treat it like a 4-lane raceway. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>That said, there are a few places were I'd like to see the places where it temporarily expands to 4-lane removed and the right lane made into a bike and right-turn only lane that is CLEARLY MARKED with solid white lines. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>One of the worst spots for this is the section…</p>
<p>I agree that Milwaukee's narrowness almost seems to act as a traffic-calming device, especially when bikes are present. Auto drivers are less-likely to try and treat it like a 4-lane raceway. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>That said, there are a few places were I'd like to see the places where it temporarily expands to 4-lane removed and the right lane made into a bike and right-turn only lane that is CLEARLY MARKED with solid white lines. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>One of the worst spots for this is the section that cuts through the circle of Logan Square proper. That area in the middle of the circle goes from 2 lanes to 4 for a few hundred yards and then back to 2 again at the other side. Cars use this area like it is a passing zone on the right lane and these inahurry cars push you right into the curbage with their buzzing with no thought at all for bikes. There is NO REASON this area needs to be 4 lanes as it is going right back to 2 again at the other side. The intersections at both sides of this the poorly-designed abortion of a traffic circle are bad enough as far as bike and ped traffic is concerned. </p>
<p> </p>
<p>The only autos that should be in the right lane are those that are turning right and only just before the intersection.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>A lot of Chicago drivers think it is perfectly OK to ram right down the "turning lane" just before an intersection and get by 3-5 cars as they approach a red light, and then as soon as the light changes slam the accelerator down and race forward to get in front of the cars to their left and go straight rather than turning. This is very dangerous to bikes in the bike lane waiting to legally cross the intersection that get caught up in this drag-racing type activity. This is one more reason I endorse the Idaho stop so we can get out there before the Indy 500 starts when the light does turn green. </p>
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<p>The right lane should be for right-turning only. Those that are using it to get by slower traffic by passing on the right should be cited. This can only happen if the lanes are more clearly marked for bikes and right-turns only and it is enforced by the city.</p>
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<p>That 4-lane section of Milwaukee at the corners of Logan/Kedzie need to be remarked as a bike-only lane and NOT a short crazy passing zone for people in a hurry to get in front of the person ahead of them only to get back in line again in single-file slow car traffic. What is the point of that anyhow? Also, the pavement on the Downtown side is so damn bad it is just crumbling like a month-old cookie and the cars push you right into that mess when they are attempting to make time in the "right" lane. </p>
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<p>Not just Elston has bad spots. There are quite a few on Milwaukee too but this one is one of my pet peeves -and not just because I live 3 blocks from there. </p>
<p><br/> <cite>Peenworm Grubologist said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?commentId=2211490%3AComment%3A299655&xg_source=msg_com_forum#2211490Comment299655"><div>Weirdly I find Milwaukee's narrowness makes it preferable during rush hour because cars are less able to move and are more predictable. Plus there's the whole safety in numbers feedback loop of choosing to bike it because a lot of people choose to bike it.</div>
</blockquote> Weirdly I find Milwaukee's na…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2996552011-03-04T17:07:01.633ZGort 12-mile Pinklegneephttps://thechainlink.org/profile/PeenwormGrubologist
Weirdly I find Milwaukee's narrowness makes it preferable during rush hour because cars are less able to move and are more predictable. Plus there's the whole safety in numbers feedback loop of choosing to bike it because a lot of people choose to bike it.
Weirdly I find Milwaukee's narrowness makes it preferable during rush hour because cars are less able to move and are more predictable. Plus there's the whole safety in numbers feedback loop of choosing to bike it because a lot of people choose to bike it. I'm not sure how someone coul…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2997422011-03-04T17:01:36.962ZLizhttps://thechainlink.org/profile/Liz657
<p>I'm not sure how someone could be against riding on Elston but not Fullerton or Western. </p>
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<p>I would ride on 7 miles on Elston every single day before I thought about riding 1 block on Fullerton or Wester. </p>
<p>There is a 1 miles strech of Elston that is dicey (Diversey to Ashland) and even that is so much better than Western or Fullerton.</p>
<p><br></br><cite>Mark Beard-Witherup said:</cite></p>
<blockquote><div><p>Everyone should stay on Milwaukee Ave. Everything negative…</p>
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<p>I'm not sure how someone could be against riding on Elston but not Fullerton or Western. </p>
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<p>I would ride on 7 miles on Elston every single day before I thought about riding 1 block on Fullerton or Wester. </p>
<p>There is a 1 miles strech of Elston that is dicey (Diversey to Ashland) and even that is so much better than Western or Fullerton.</p>
<p><br/><cite>Mark Beard-Witherup said:</cite></p>
<blockquote><div><p>Everyone should stay on Milwaukee Ave. Everything negative said about Elston is spot on. Cars too fast, boring scenery, zig-zag bike lane...it really sucks! PLEASE everyone stay on Milwaukee. Western is good, too, as is Fullerton.</p>
<p>Leave Elston to we few, we happy few, we band of brothers (as sisters.) </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Ashland/Elston is an adult dose so I just take Cortland to Damen during heavy traffic times</p>
<p>Discretion is the greater part of valor.</p>
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<p>BikeBoy5</p>
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</blockquote> Everyone should stay on Milwa…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2996462011-03-04T16:48:12.909ZBikeBoy5https://thechainlink.org/profile/MarkBeardWitherup
<p>Everyone should stay on Milwaukee Ave. Everything negative said about Elston is spot on. Cars too fast, boring scenery, zig-zag bike lane...it really sucks! PLEASE everyone stay on Milwaukee. Western is good, too, as is Fullerton.</p>
<p>Leave Elston to we few, we happy few, we band of brothers (as sisters.) </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Ashland/Elston is an adult dose so I just take Cortland to Damen during heavy traffic times</p>
<p>Discretion is the greater part of…</p>
<p>Everyone should stay on Milwaukee Ave. Everything negative said about Elston is spot on. Cars too fast, boring scenery, zig-zag bike lane...it really sucks! PLEASE everyone stay on Milwaukee. Western is good, too, as is Fullerton.</p>
<p>Leave Elston to we few, we happy few, we band of brothers (as sisters.) </p>
<p> </p>
<p>Ashland/Elston is an adult dose so I just take Cortland to Damen during heavy traffic times</p>
<p>Discretion is the greater part of valor.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>BikeBoy5</p>
<p> </p> I think the photo essay expla…tag:thechainlink.org,2011-03-04:2211490:Comment:2997112011-03-04T03:39:57.073ZJoe Byrdhttps://thechainlink.org/profile/JoeBilly
I think the photo essay explains a bit about why I choose Elston. I ride my son to Whitney Young once a weekon a burley duet tandem from Albany Park around 6am and so this means 2 things - less car traffic and an easily attainable 18-20mph. I agree with all the cons described in the photo essay, especially with the right turn cars while coming north, but they represent to me the "hypervigilant" parts of the ride, whereas on Milwaukee, it's much more random and stress producing with a much…
I think the photo essay explains a bit about why I choose Elston. I ride my son to Whitney Young once a weekon a burley duet tandem from Albany Park around 6am and so this means 2 things - less car traffic and an easily attainable 18-20mph. I agree with all the cons described in the photo essay, especially with the right turn cars while coming north, but they represent to me the "hypervigilant" parts of the ride, whereas on Milwaukee, it's much more random and stress producing with a much higher number of near misses. We used to take Elston to Damen to Jackson? to get to Whitney but the section of Damen from Fullerton to Chicago is one of my least favorite streets in Chicago where we just have to slow down to a crawl of 12-14 mph because of the pedestrians that just step out into the bike lane without a look or thought. I know that we are in a little different place on a tandem because it makes the velocity discrepancy between you and the cars overtaking you lower and it also makes you much more concerned with the potential for doing serious damage to a pedestrian, the road bike with person at 180 pounds going 15 mph that hits the spaced out pedestrian is one thing, but the tandem at 350 pounds going 20 mph has almost 3 times the momentum when it crashes into that scenester pulverizing bones to mush. Sorry to be so long winded, but that why we take Elston. If you see a tandem with Tidy Cat panniers be sure to give us a shout<br/>
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<cite>Steven Vance said:</cite><br />
<blockquote cite="http://www.thechainlink.org/forum/topics/milwaukee-v-elston?id=2211490%3ATopic%3A299205&page=3#2211490Comment299401"><div><p>I decided to tell you what I dislike about Elston in a photo essay, but first let me describe my "typical commute."</p>
<p>I moved to Avondale, near Belmont/Elston/California. Elston is about 500 feet from my house. Milwaukee is a little less than 1 mile away. I much prefer riding down California to hop on Milwaukee towards downtown, UIC, and Pilsen (my most frequent haunts). </p>
<p>Each photo describes one reason why I dislike Elston and what you're seeing in the photo. </p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesbondsv/sets/72157626189814070/">Start the photo essay</a></p>
<a rel="nofollow" title="Super wide intersection by Steven Vance, on Flickr" href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamesbondsv/5495345960/"><img alt="Super wide intersection" src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5012/5495345960_2c7037b704.jpg" width="500" height="375"/></a></div>
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