The Chainlink

While we've had some good news about the enactment of new laws against distracted driving, the timing of this expansion of distracting technology in cars is ironic, to say the least. This is an attempt to put corporate greed above public safety.

I've been in cars where the driver was distracted by trying to read a navigation screen, much less trying to do anything involving more complex choices like web browsing. We need to have a lot less distracted driving, not more.

If someone has a display for web browsing in their car, even if the manufacturer has configured it so that browsing it disabled when the car is in gear, who's to say that the car owner won't pay someone to hack the system so that web browsing is possible at any time, offering too much possible distraction.

I'm writing letters to my federal legislators asking them to oppose this expansion of distracting technology in cars for the U.S. market. Anyone else care to join me?

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Tank-Ridin' Ryan said:
You live on the Internet? How's the rent? Are utilities included? I'm assuming Internet access is free.

Ryan L said:
LOL, I sound like an angry bitter old man in my posts. An angry old man that throws smoke bombs at cars while drunk that is. Ah the internet, what an interesting place to live.

It's free for those that sell their soul!
These are the kinds of discussions I would hope you're expecting me to jump into by now :)

I am against legislation that would ban computers from the front seats of cars, or other so called distracting technology while not driving. It's pandering to the lowest common denominator; another case of the reckless few ruining it for the rest of us. Why just last monday night I was sitting in the parking lot of the restaurant that the midwest subaru owners club -chicago city dwellers chapter - chose for it's weekly get together. I was in my friend's forester sti, my wrx was parked next to it. We were waiting for the others to arrive and he was adjusting the settings for the computer he had under the passenger seat - it's large display popped up from under the stock clock location in the center of the upper dash. The primary purpose of installing that computer was to allow him to retune the factory ecu that controls the engine parameters. We actually tune our cars to be cleaner and more efficient than when they leave the factory in japan, set up to run at either sea level or in Denver and other large tolerances that make the car dirtier, but work to a factory assigned "optimum" anywhere and everywhere(there's that lowest common denominator again). We tune to the local gas and conditions making the car more efficient and cleaner(and yes, more powerful and faster). In 5th gear he got a knock accelerating on the highway from very low rpms, so he went into the computer, and adjusted the fuel delivery at that specific point and load.

This is a hobby for us much like cycling and working on bikes is for many of you(and me), or tinkering with computers, or playing team sports, or spinning pottery, or knitting, or brewing beer, or restoring old furniture, or any other creative hands on outlet you can think of to keep yourself from going insane with the day to day.

The Itasca Subaru STI police cars have a saying on the back: "keep it on the track". That's what many of us do and I encourage any of you with a car to take it to an autocross or rallycross regardless of what kind of car it is. It's more challenging that you might think, and more rewarding too. Like one of my old friend's father used to say - "if you don't find motor-sports exciting, you've never been to a race in person." Carbon footprints aside, the human experience at a racetrack is second to none. (say, anyone ever enjoy the atmosphere of a crit or tour? how bout the velodrome?)

Now I know not all of us are perfect, and there are plenty of idiots out there...like the carload full of teenagers that drove by us monday in their Evo, back and forth, circling like a shark looking for a street race for about 20 minutes. We just shook our heads in shame and disgust. And please don't go off on us tuner racers causing accidents blah blah...the suv that took himself out on I55 two cars in front of me two weeks ago did it all by himself changing lanes. He swerved, changed his mind, swerved back, lost the rear end, tried to save it badly (get off the gas, not on it dumbass) and ended up in the ditch. Lucky SOB went in straight or he would have rolled it.

So please, PLEASE, if you have a beef with cars and drivers - start your fight with the foundation! Learning to control you vehicle and what it's capable of! (I'm talking out of control danger capabilities, not how high the speedo goes)

(I apologize if there are any run on or poorly constructed sentences in there)
I wholeheartedly agree with this and would like to add a few of my points. Driving is a science and an art form just like biking. I personally would love to disable about half the safety features on my car, between the ABS, traction control, stability control, brake boost, and countless other safety features anyone with half a brain can drive and do most of the time.

I personally would hate the idea of a car "braking" for me, there are a number of situations where it is better to just keep your foot off the brake and steer around the obstacle, opposed to wasting the precious cornering grip by braking. Anyone who has been to a half decent performance driving school will be well aware of this. Instead of penalizing drivers in general why not try to improve the driver's ed requirements, or the testing procedures in order to get a license instead of handing them out to anyone who can pass a written test that could be passed by an 8 year old and a driving test that actually test nothing that really matters to driving? Why aren't these kids are being taken out to a skid pad as part of their driver's ed and being thought how to recover from a spin, proper braking, cornering, and handling skills?

And please refrain yourself from jumping onto any new technology so quickly the Volvo mentioned above is a huge heap of problems waiting to happen.

-Ali

GabeW (not the other Gabe) said:
These are the kinds of discussions I would hope you're expecting me to jump into by now :)

I am against legislation that would ban computers from the front seats of cars, or other so called distracting technology while not driving. It's pandering to the lowest common denominator; another case of the reckless few ruining it for the rest of us. Why just last monday night I was sitting in the parking lot of the restaurant that the midwest subaru owners club -chicago city dwellers chapter - chose for it's weekly get together. I was in my friend's forester sti, my wrx was parked next to it. We were waiting for the others to arrive and he was adjusting the settings for the computer he had under the passenger seat - it's large display popped up from under the stock clock location in the center of the upper dash. The primary purpose of installing that computer was to allow him to retune the factory ecu that controls the engine parameters. We actually tune our cars to be cleaner and more efficient than when they leave the factory in japan, set up to run at either sea level or in Denver and other large tolerances that make the car dirtier, but work to a factory assigned "optimum" anywhere and everywhere(there's that lowest common denominator again). We tune to the local gas and conditions making the car more efficient and cleaner(and yes, more powerful and faster). In 5th gear he got a knock accelerating on the highway from very low rpms, so he went into the computer, and adjusted the fuel delivery at that specific point and load.

This is a hobby for us much like cycling and working on bikes is for many of you(and me), or tinkering with computers, or playing team sports, or spinning pottery, or knitting, or brewing beer, or restoring old furniture, or any other creative hands on outlet you can think of to keep yourself from going insane with the day to day.

The Itasca Subaru STI police cars have a saying on the back: "keep it on the track". That's what many of us do and I encourage any of you with a car to take it to an autocross or rallycross regardless of what kind of car it is. It's more challenging that you might think, and more rewarding too. Like one of my old friend's father used to say - "if you don't find motor-sports exciting, you've never been to a race in person." Carbon footprints aside, the human experience at a racetrack is second to none. (say, anyone ever enjoy the atmosphere of a crit or tour? how bout the velodrome?)

Now I know not all of us are perfect, and there are plenty of idiots out there...like the carload full of teenagers that drove by us monday in their Evo, back and forth, circling like a shark looking for a street race for about 20 minutes. We just shook our heads in shame and disgust. And please don't go off on us tuner racers causing accidents blah blah...the suv that took himself out on I55 two cars in front of me two weeks ago did it all by himself changing lanes. He swerved, changed his mind, swerved back, lost the rear end, tried to save it badly (get off the gas, not on it dumbass) and ended up in the ditch. Lucky SOB went in straight or he would have rolled it.

So please, PLEASE, if you have a beef with cars and drivers - start your fight with the foundation! Learning to control you vehicle and what it's capable of! (I'm talking out of control danger capabilities, not how high the speedo goes)

(I apologize if there are any run on or poorly constructed sentences in there)
Maybe they didn't want to be seen?
What does "almost hit" mean? Does it mean you wanted to hit them but missed?

Ryan L said:
Ill tell you one thing I noticed last night on my little drive to and from the new Whole Foods on Kingsley, the amount of dingles on bikes, at night, that don't have a single light on 'em is retarded.

I can understand all the crazy cats that are too cool for school to wear a helmet, but come on guys, gals and hermaphrodites, get some lights on those bikes. I can't tell you how many cyclists I couldn't see till they were right next to me because they had no lights. The ones that did have lights, guess what, I knew they were there. Shoot, i've almost had two collisions with other cyclists at dark intersections because they had no lights. If I ever get hit by one of these invisible cool kids of the night, i'm gonna go medieval on 'em. There's more than one reason I carry an adjustable wrench on me at all times :)

Stupid Humans!!!
interesting you brought up the point about bikers not being seen H3, just last night in that terrible fog I was driving south on Ashland just north of Devon - a cyclist with a light (thank god he had one) coming towards me cut across the road right in front of me. It was one of those get to the other side of the street before the car since I can't make my left turn sooner if I do it properly moves. The only reason I was covering my brake was because I saw him coming and I ride that route to evanston. I know there's a turn there for the bike route. Had I not known this I would have hit him, or at the very least have to slam on my brakes and scare the shit out of myself, my wife in the passenger seat, and anyone else on the road.

Rider - you were in red and on a road bike, and made eye contact with me as you turned left. It was about 9pm


I'll also add this to the discussion:



And Ali - Thanks! I won't call you elitist for thinking education is a good thing :)
I also wired up an armed missile launcher style switch on my dash that turns the ABS on/off. On for street driving, off for track. It's pretty simple, just hack open a fuse, solder wires to the prongs you pulled out of the fuse, solder those up to the switch with an in-line fuse, and plug the hacked prongs back into the fuse location for the ABS. Flipping the switch "breaks" the fuse. Pretty neat. Be careful thought, you might spend an hour sitting in the parked car after you install it watching the light on the dash..ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off, :lol:
0:55 - "They take driving seriously from day 1....this is a 16 year old taking a drivers ed course"

...and look at the BIG BIG smile one that kid's face as he learns how the car handles on the skidpad...yeah, no way we could convince american teens to do that ;)

....and look at Hakkinen while he's driving around the track. He's calm as can be and the car is sliding it's limits. He's experienced.
Gabe,
Maybe if you drive less you'll have less of these incidents that you seem to attract?
Personally, I've noticed that I get cut off and ignored =more= when I have a front light.
Anecdotal, but what in this thread isn't?

GabeW (not the other Gabe) said:
interesting you brought up the point about bikers not being seen H3, just last night in that terrible fog I was driving south on Ashland just north of Devon - a cyclist with a light (thank god he had one) coming towards me cut across the road right in front of me. It was one of those get to the other side of the street before the car since I can't make my left turn sooner if I do it properly moves. The only reason I was covering my brake was because I saw him coming and I ride that route to evanston. I know there's a turn there for the bike route. Had I not known this I would have hit him, or at the very least have to slam on my brakes and scare the shit out of myself, my wife in the passenger seat, and anyone else on the road.
Rider - you were in red and on a road bike, and made eye contact with me as you turned left. It was about 9pm

I'll also add this to the discussion:



And Ali - Thanks! I won't call you elitist for thinking education is a good thing :)
I also wired up an armed missile launcher style switch on my dash that turns the ABS on/off. On for street driving, off for track. It's pretty simple, just hack open a fuse, solder wires to the prongs you pulled out of the fuse, solder those up to the switch with an in-line fuse, and plug the hacked prongs back into the fuse location for the ABS. Flipping the switch "breaks" the fuse. Pretty neat. Be careful thought, you might spend an hour sitting in the parked car after you install it watching the light on the dash..ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off, :lol:
H3N3 said:
Maybe they didn't want to be seen?
What does "almost hit" mean? Does it mean you wanted to hit them but missed?

It means I almost collided with another cyclist perpendicular to my path. I know they saw me yet I couldn't see them.
Howard - My experience has been the opposite, especially with a helmet-mounted headlight that I aim at the driver if they seem not to see me. That tends to get the desired response.

H3N3 said:
Personally, I've noticed that I get cut off and ignored =more= when I have a front light.
Anecdotal, but what in this thread isn't?

GabeW (not the other Gabe) said:
interesting you brought up the point about bikers not being seen H3, just last night in that terrible fog I was driving south on Ashland just north of Devon - a cyclist with a light (thank god he had one) coming towards me cut across the road right in front of me. It was one of those get to the other side of the street before the car since I can't make my left turn sooner if I do it properly moves. ....

Good point about the bike-mounted GPS. I think that's relevant to the discussion.

And, more education is a good thing. When I lived in NH and had to drive a lot more and deal with lots of snow all winter, I would go out at least once at the start of each snow season for a bit of practice driving. I'd go to an empty parking lot after the first significant snow and practice cornering, braking and skidding in the snow. Very useful for learning correction to a skid without overcorrecting.

GabeW (not the other Gabe) said:
interesting you brought up the point about bikers not being seen H3, just last night in that terrible fog I was driving south on Ashland just north of Devon - a cyclist with a light (thank god he had one) coming towards me cut across the road right in front of me. It was one of those get to the other side of the street before the car since I can't make my left turn sooner if I do it properly moves. The only reason I was covering my brake was because I saw him coming and I ride that route to evanston. I know there's a turn there for the bike route. Had I not known this I would have hit him, or at the very least have to slam on my brakes and scare the shit out of myself, my wife in the passenger seat, and anyone else on the road.

Rider - you were in red and on a road bike, and made eye contact with me as you turned left. It was about 9pm


I'll also add this to the discussion:



And Ali - Thanks! I won't call you elitist for thinking education is a good thing :)
I also wired up an armed missile launcher style switch on my dash that turns the ABS on/off. On for street driving, off for track. It's pretty simple, just hack open a fuse, solder wires to the prongs you pulled out of the fuse, solder those up to the switch with an in-line fuse, and plug the hacked prongs back into the fuse location for the ABS. Flipping the switch "breaks" the fuse. Pretty neat. Be careful thought, you might spend an hour sitting in the parked car after you install it watching the light on the dash..ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off,ABS on, ABS off, :lol:
"November 30, 2006

HOUSTON (Reuters) -- High gasoline prices not only slowed fuel demand growth and cut sales of gas-guzzling vehicles in 2005, they also prompted Americans to drive less for the first time in 25 years, a consulting group said in a report Thursday.

The drop in driving was small - the average American drove 13,657 miles (21,978.8 km) per year in 2005, down from 13,711 miles in 2004 - b...


I bought my car in 2005 with around 60xxx miles on it. I now have 85xxx miles on it. That's 5000 miles per year, or around 13 miles/day. My bike sees more than that regularly. I'm not surprised you say a bike cutting off a car is the car's fault for being on the road, but it doesn't really make any argument for you. Your response also seams to make it sound like I cut off a cyclist...It was the other way around, and it pissed me off. I like to give bikes room on the road since all that time I spend on my bike, I experience those incidents that I seem to attract like getting buzzed by suv's, doors opening, I've been hit by left turners in intersections...bu anyway...most cyclists I encounter while driving are considerate, this guy wasn't and he set a bad example for others.
H3N3 said:
Gabe,
Maybe if you drive less you'll have less of these incidents that you seem to attract? Personally, I've noticed that I get cut off and ignored =more= when I have a front light. Anecdotal, but what in this thread isn't?


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